It's because we feel we can control the circumstances of the car crash. We cannot feel in control of airliners. We're hapless baggage.
Generally agree, although I think it is largely an illusion. Many people die in car accidents they did not cause.
Why we ignore thousands of daily car crashes
281–290 of 1001 posts
Re: Why we ignore thousands of daily car crashes
#282Earlier quoted context omitted.
Aside from the fact your own death is always going to impose a cost on society, I'd assume having a seatbelt on as a driver significantly increases your ability to maintain at least some control of a vehicle in a collision, reducing your chance of injuring others (both in and outside said vehicle).
You have a right to be stupid, even if it results in your death. > I'd assume having a seatbelt on as a driver significantly increases your ability to maintain at least some control of a vehicle in a collision Not a chance. The g forces are tremendous, and you're just along for the ride in a collision. In my major accident, I had a lap belt on, but my arms and legs and torso flung about totally out of my control.
Seatbelts don't magically stop major accidents from happening. But they definitely keep minor accidents from turning into major accidents.
They don't keep you in control after you slam into something head on or flip the car.
They keep you in control after you clip a deer, or hit a rock, or someone rear-ends you, or you swerve hard to avoid something, and that can be the difference between a good story and killing yourself or others.
Re: Why we ignore thousands of daily car crashes
#283I was a cop for several years. I worked hundreds of crashes, and a few fatalities. If cars had a max speed limit of 85 mph, and required the seatbelt to be engaged to work, we'd cut our fatality rate in half. Most nations' DUI laws consider a 0.05 BAC as illegal. In most US states 0.08 is presumed under the influence, 0.06 - 0.079 is considered no presumption either way, and under .06 is considered not under the infl…
Not wearing a seatbelt is an individual choice, and should not be a crime. P.S. Growing up, my dad had the dealer install seatbelts in the family wagon before he picked it up. We never moved an inch unless everyone was buckled up. Nobody else, and I mean nobody else, had seatbelts in their car at the time. P.P.S. Seatbelts also saved my life.
Its a choice that effects others. When you get ejected from the crash and hit someone else's car. When we have to shut down the interstate north and south bound for 3 hours to do a full reconstruction. When we have to do a death notification.
Dealing with a dead body isnt a big deal. Your mind kinda puts it in the pile of "just evidence". Working the fatality is easy. The hard part is the death notification. Having to find the family member, either waking them up at 2 am or knocking on the door in the middle of an otherwise normal afternoon. Its not like brain surgery gone bad. There was 0 warning of this happening. Noones prepaered for it.
Death notification is a full day of training in our academy. Noone deserves to learn their loved one died on the news or thru a rumor or over the phone. You have to tell them in person.
And you have to be blunt. Anything less just makes it harder to cope. "There was a crash, he didn't make it" leaves their mind to fabricate a weak lie, like maybe he didn't make avoiding the crash, and he's just hurt. This just makes the pain last that much longer
"Sir, I'm sorry to tell you that your son was killed in a motor vehicle crash".
If you want to make dumb decisions, that's fine, but don't try to justify it with this isolated "well it's my choice" nonsense. Your choice effects others, and I can still remember the reaction of every single death notification I've done. The viet nam vet trying to pass a tractor trailer on his motorcycle, and the way his wife screamed. Having to tell a Dad who's son was touring a college, that his sone was the only one in the car not in a seat belt. Having to wake a mother up at 2 in the morning to tell her her son is dead, and not having an answer to "How do I tell his little sister"
Individual choices generally effect more than the individual
Re: Why we ignore thousands of daily car crashes
#284Earlier quoted context omitted.
> If cars had a max speed limit of 85 mph, and required the seatbelt to be engaged to work Wait, wearing a seatbelt is not mandatory?
They are, but cars will function without them being used.
At least in Europe, there is a very annoying beep if you don't wear the seatbelt. You can still drive, and there are ways to disable it, but most people just wear their seatbelt.
I don't think it is mandatory, but it counts in the EuroNCAP score, and since it is one of the easiest safety feature to implement, they all have it.
Re: Why we ignore thousands of daily car crashes
#285There’s an audio version of the same point here: https://podcast.strongtowns.org/e/the-drip-drip-drip-of-traf... A ”best effort” summary of this article: if thousands of people die in once place, it’s one of the great tragedies in American history. However if thousands of people die in thousands different places, it is ignored and considered a fact of life. When a plane or train crashes, we stop everything and redesi…
In addition, the extra expense associated with regulation to make planes ultra-safe makes it unaffordable for some people. Those people then go on to use a vastly less safe form of transportation.
Re: Why we ignore thousands of daily car crashes
#286Earlier quoted context omitted.
Not going to happen.
Well that’s a bold statement, guess the rest of us are just wrong and there are no externalities associated with not wearing a seat belt
First off, the physics are you are going to be thrown into whatever your car hit. Second, I've never, ever heard of a flying body hurting someone else.
Re: Why we ignore thousands of daily car crashes
#287Earlier quoted context omitted.
Not wearing a seat belt is dangerous to others when you're catapulted through your windshield at 90mph into traffic. This is not the clear-cut case you want to make it out to be.
If you're catapulted through your windshield, you're going to hit whatever you drove into, not traffic.
If you hit a giant wall, sure.
In the other case, a violent roll over accident will happily eject you from a side window and off on a happy trajectory towards whatever might be in that direction.
Forward through the windshield is hardly the only way to be ejected.
Re: Why we ignore thousands of daily car crashes
#288Earlier quoted context omitted.
Should we treat all behaviors that are associated with a significantly increased mortality rate the same way, or should we pick and choose depending on the political and social context at the time, like we do with seatbelts?
Few other behaviors associated with increase mortality can also turn you into a missile. https://youtu.be/bdW_3oQFO0c?t=42
Be that as it may, that wasn't the point I was replying to.
Re: Why we ignore thousands of daily car crashes
#289Earlier quoted context omitted.
You have to look at kilometers driven per person, not just ownership. Americans drive far far more than most other industrialized nations. https://frontiergroup.org/blogs/blog/fg/fact-file-americans-...
America is huge and lots of it isn't densely populated.
Hence the claim it’s designed for cars
Re: Why we ignore thousands of daily car crashes
#290There’s an audio version of the same point here: https://podcast.strongtowns.org/e/the-drip-drip-drip-of-traf... A ”best effort” summary of this article: if thousands of people die in once place, it’s one of the great tragedies in American history. However if thousands of people die in thousands different places, it is ignored and considered a fact of life. When a plane or train crashes, we stop everything and redesi…
The same goes for the vaccines and the FDA.
Example of the "the brave maverick comment" like the "the brave maverick doctor" mentioned in this npr article https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2022/07/19/1111794...