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In microtransit, passengers order a shuttle van instead of having to take a bus

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Re: In microtransit, passengers order a shuttle van instead of having to take a bus

#81

> These days, the service runs about 37,000 trips a week, Lentz said, or more than two and a half times the 26,000 rides the old bus system ran in a typical, pre-pandemic week. Are "trips" different from "rides" in some way that makes this arithmetic correct?

Sounds like a "trip" is roundtrip (two rides) - so 37,000 trips is 74,000 rides, which is more than deuce and a half times 26,000.

Re: In microtransit, passengers order a shuttle van instead of having to take a bus

#82

Make of this what you will: North Carolina’s cities used to have remarkably developed streetcar networks[1]. It is depressing and frustrating to see public authorities attempt to recreate the successes of public transport on fundamentally inefficient, commons-hostile substrates. [1]: https://www.ourstate.com/history-of-north-carolina-streetcar...

I live in a city with a "modern" streetcar. I even rode it to work for a few months. Two reasons why it's not great.

1. It shares busy streets with cars yet has zero ability to maneuver in traffic. If just one car is parked a few inches beyond the edge of the parking lane, the entire streetcar route is blocked.

2. The tracks trap bicycle tires and cause many bicycle crashes. This happened to colleague of mine, fortunately at low speed. There have been dozens of crashes and at least one death.

Electric bus service is cheaper to install and has neither of these disadvantages.

Re: In microtransit, passengers order a shuttle van instead of having to take a bus

#83

Public transit that is not subway on rails suck big time. I have wasted thousands of hours waiting for the bus that either came early, or is late, under 100 degrees of sun and under snowstorms. Add to that the I have walked thousands of miles because the bus stops do not align with my destinations. Since I got a car and live in the suburbs, I pay much lower housing costs, I start exactly 20’ before my punch in time,…

Public bus transit and private car transit are inherently in conflict. You basically can't run them on the same streets and expect the bus to not suck.

You could, of course, run the bus in a dedicated, separate right-of-way to solve that problem. But like you said, just build rail at that point

Re: In microtransit, passengers order a shuttle van instead of having to take a bus

#84

Public transit that is not subway on rails suck big time. I have wasted thousands of hours waiting for the bus that either came early, or is late, under 100 degrees of sun and under snowstorms. Add to that the I have walked thousands of miles because the bus stops do not align with my destinations. Since I got a car and live in the suburbs, I pay much lower housing costs, I start exactly 20’ before my punch in time,…

Public bus systems can be good; most cities and municipalities simply don't bother to make it so (because "polite society" drives everywhere). NYC's buses have their own flaws, but they demonstrate many of the necessary conditions for success: dedicated bus lanes, split-service (local and express on the same route, with corresponding bus sizes), and multimodal connections (light rail, streetcars, subways). This is al…

Sounds pretty good, if you overlook people smoking meth or crack, publicly urinating and defecating on the bus, violence, etc. Not unique to buses for sure. Thanks, but I'll keep my "polite society" vehicle and properly planned highways in Orange County.

Re: In microtransit, passengers order a shuttle van instead of having to take a bus

#85

Yessss!!! There is no best one-size-for-all solution for transportation, we need lots of different methods to select the best methods for the situation. Scooters, [e-]bikes, vans, trolleys, buses, subways, trains, funiculars. (And more that have yet to be invented; personally I hope for rentable e-assist pedi-cabs to take cargo like groceries home in cities without the need for a 2-ton+ vehicle) I think this van serv…

This kind of strategy must be combined with changing the ways cities are built. Your last point about the single mom, this SHOULDNT be a problem. At all. How did people 100 years ago deal with not having access to food without a time consuming trip? They either grew their own, or they lived close enough to a place where they could buy it. The private automobile completely killed the idea of living close to what you need.

Re: In microtransit, passengers order a shuttle van instead of having to take a bus

#86

Public transit that is not subway on rails suck big time. I have wasted thousands of hours waiting for the bus that either came early, or is late, under 100 degrees of sun and under snowstorms. Add to that the I have walked thousands of miles because the bus stops do not align with my destinations. Since I got a car and live in the suburbs, I pay much lower housing costs, I start exactly 20’ before my punch in time,…

> Public transit that is not subway on rails suck big time. Bus Rapid Transit called. It promised 95% of the raw speed and 4x the service frequency at 25% of the cost.

Bus Rapid Transit calls when you are proposing a subway or a tram, promising great things at a low price. After you agree to settle for a shinier bus line instead of the nice, fast, reliable transit system you originally wanted, the value engineers get to work compromising the design, and you end up with... another bus route. Maybe it has a different color of paint this time.

Re: In microtransit, passengers order a shuttle van instead of having to take a bus

#87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Public bus systems can be good; most cities and municipalities simply don't bother to make it so (because "polite society" drives everywhere). NYC's buses have their own flaws, but they demonstrate many of the necessary conditions for success: dedicated bus lanes, split-service (local and express on the same route, with corresponding bus sizes), and multimodal connections (light rail, streetcars, subways). This is al…

Sounds pretty good, if you overlook people smoking meth or crack, publicly urinating and defecating on the bus, violence, etc. Not unique to buses for sure. Thanks, but I'll keep my "polite society" vehicle and properly planned highways in Orange County.

You don't see that during rush hour.

Re: In microtransit, passengers order a shuttle van instead of having to take a bus

#88

Aren’t these just subsidized taxis? They don’t help with congestion, they don’t help with pollution, I don’t see how they ultimately bring down costs since you still need individual cars and drivers... Perhaps in some limited cases, multiple people going the same way at the same time can share a vehicle, but how often will that work out in practice? I basically never end up sharing an Uber/Lyft with anyone else despi…

Less parking needed if people take these. In my suburb, it may be hard to get an Lyft and it may cost like $6 to go 1-2 miles if they do show up. Other than that, if I don't have a car, there's no bus to take me to most parts of the city, I'd have to walk or ride or a bike.

Yes, they seem like subsidized taxis but with more capacity than normal taxis and maybe less direct routes than normal taxis. If people have more time than money, I think this can help.

In terms of pollution and congestion, if they increase the density of people traveling more than they increase the total distance traveled, then I would assume they help reduce both.

Re: In microtransit, passengers order a shuttle van instead of having to take a bus

#89

Make of this what you will: North Carolina’s cities used to have remarkably developed streetcar networks[1]. It is depressing and frustrating to see public authorities attempt to recreate the successes of public transport on fundamentally inefficient, commons-hostile substrates. [1]: https://www.ourstate.com/history-of-north-carolina-streetcar...

I live in a city with a "modern" streetcar. I even rode it to work for a few months. Two reasons why it's not great. 1. It shares busy streets with cars yet has zero ability to maneuver in traffic. If just one car is parked a few inches beyond the edge of the parking lane, the entire streetcar route is blocked. 2. The tracks trap bicycle tires and cause many bicycle crashes. This happened to colleague of mine, fortun…

Both of these are serious issues, and point to an underlying problem: cities have been re-planned around their streetcar networks, not with them in mind. Improperly planned, streetcars are just less mobile buses.

There are known solutions to both of these: give streetcars unilateral right of way, isolate them from car traffic at intersections and stops, and give cyclists their own separated lanes.

Depending on the city, electric bus service might be the right choice! But I'll note: we undid all of the things that make streetcars advantageous, and we could redo them with sufficient political will.

Re: In microtransit, passengers order a shuttle van instead of having to take a bus

#90

Public transit that is not subway on rails suck big time. I have wasted thousands of hours waiting for the bus that either came early, or is late, under 100 degrees of sun and under snowstorms. Add to that the I have walked thousands of miles because the bus stops do not align with my destinations. Since I got a car and live in the suburbs, I pay much lower housing costs, I start exactly 20’ before my punch in time,…

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