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EU Digital Markets Act, aimed at Google, Apple, Amazon, approved

consilium.europa.eu

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Re: EU Digital Markets Act, aimed at Google, Apple, Amazon, approved

#161

Post by hef19898 »

DCKing wrote: post #136
yoavm wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interestingly enough, an iPhone that complies with these demands is actually the first iPhone I'd ever consider paying for. I wonder if this might actually increase adoption.

Agreed. I switched from an iPhone to a Pixel because the iPhone experience is claustrophobic (admittedly I switched from Android to iPhone before that for the much better and lengthy software Apple gives). If this means the iPhone is getting things similar to F-Droid and NewPipe I'd be happy to switch back. The new iPads have an M1 chip with virtualization capabilities, but you wouldn't know it with the stuff Apple a…

Ha, a iPad running Linux would be something I'd look at.

It is a surprise so, that the EU is actually moving, at scale, in that direction. Maybe privacy, processed food and some other things next!

Re: EU Digital Markets Act, aimed at Google, Apple, Amazon, approved

#163

Post by MichaelCollins »

rvz wrote: post #152
tgv wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> User any browser and browser engine and choose to make it default Hello, Alphabet world domination. They finally get the chance to get rid of that pesky Safari. Next stop: obligatory sign-in for using a service.

See. It is frankly pointless. Chrome already has a significant amount of mindshare and will grow even more after this. The users have already chosen Chrome (and its derivatives). Mozilla has done absolutely nothing to stop it as Firefox has become totally irrelevant today. The EU is about to allow the world domination of Chrome and its derivatives to takeover entirely. Just like the many choices of a Linux distro, yo…

Mozilla self-sabotages so frequently and severely, I think you need to be very naive to not suspect the massive amount of funding they get from Google has something to do with it.

Re: EU Digital Markets Act, aimed at Google, Apple, Amazon, approved

#164

Post by zaarn »

losvedir wrote: post #143

I'm sort of surprised at the positive tone here. Sure, it's nice for non-technical people to enumerate a lot of nice to haves, but just asserting something doesn't make it true or possible. As one example, making "core messaging functionality interoperable". How exactly does that work with end-to-end encryption? I suppose we'd need some sort of open system and protocol for all the tricky key sharing stuff? That would…

The "limit payment possibilities" means that, f.e., Apple cannot stop a banking app from using the on-device secure enclave and the NFC functionality from making payments available if Apple also offers a payment service using those functions (or to say it differently; If Google or Apple make a payments app, they must allow everyone to develop their own payment apps for their ecosystems and make all functions available that are necessary to have all functionality of Google or Apple's own apps).

Re: EU Digital Markets Act, aimed at Google, Apple, Amazon, approved

#165

Post by fsflover »

aloisdg wrote: post #155
fsflover wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You already can have a phone running GNU/Linux (Librem 5 or Pinephone) though.

Yes but I may have a on old working iphone laying in my desktop that I would like to reuse for ecological reason

I have little hope that Apple will release enough information to develop free drivers for your phone. Without such information, you have to forever use an outdated, vulnerable Linux kernel. See also: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26593274.

Re: EU Digital Markets Act, aimed at Google, Apple, Amazon, approved

#166

Post by capableweb »

golemotron wrote: post #162

At what point does it just become cheaper and more prudent to leave the EU market?

Considering that the EU is the second largest consumer market in the world (at least according to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_largest_consumer_marke...), it seems like that point is kind of far away.

Re: EU Digital Markets Act, aimed at Google, Apple, Amazon, approved

#167

Post by [deleted] »

lotsofpulp wrote: post #126
bloppe wrote: post #81

It blows my mind how many people have bought into Apple's position on this. No, Apple restricting your freedom does not afford you greater security. You, as an adult, can choose not to install shady software. If you're not confident in your ability to tell shady from legit, just stick to the App Store. Don't demand that Apple treat the rest of us like children just because that's how you would like to be treated.

>You, as an adult, can choose not to install shady software. For whatever reason, my dad cannot choose to not install shady software. Keeping him in iOS land is the only thing that has worked at keeping his devices clean.

[deleted]

Re: EU Digital Markets Act, aimed at Google, Apple, Amazon, approved

#168

Post by seydor »

losvedir wrote: post #143

I'm sort of surprised at the positive tone here. Sure, it's nice for non-technical people to enumerate a lot of nice to haves, but just asserting something doesn't make it true or possible. As one example, making "core messaging functionality interoperable". How exactly does that work with end-to-end encryption? I suppose we'd need some sort of open system and protocol for all the tricky key sharing stuff? That would…

it says core messaging, maybe only unencrypted chats can be interoperable.

TBH , unlike GDPR, this seems a lot more pragmatic and feasible

Re: EU Digital Markets Act, aimed at Google, Apple, Amazon, approved

#169

Post by tzs »

shadowgovt wrote: post #101
Gareth321 wrote: post #2

This is easily one of the most expansive Acts regarding computing devices passed in my lifetime. The summary is in the link. As an iPhone user, this will enable me to: * Install any software * Install any App Store and choose to make it default * Use third party payment providers and choose to make them default * Use any voice assistant and choose to make it default * User any browser and browser engine and choose to…

Possibly. The other possibility is it will make it impossible to buy an iPhone in Europe. It certainly puts a huge incentive on Apple to figure out technical solutions to problems like "How do we get other browser engines on this thing without compromising a hundred OS assumptions, battery performance, or user security," but it's also possible Apple decides that's a no-go and it'll cost more than 25% of annual revenu…

> It certainly puts a huge incentive on Apple to figure out technical solutions to problems like "How do we get other browser engines on this thing without compromising a hundred OS assumptions, battery performance, or user security,"

Virtualization? Run a hypervisor on the phone that allows running multiple virtual smartphones. Apple can provide two virtual smartphone environments, one that works like the current native iOS, and one that provides a basic smartphone that is wide open and on which you can install anything you want (maybe based on Android?). Make this second one open source so it can be a basis third parties can use to develop more virtual smartphones for iPhone hardware.

Re: EU Digital Markets Act, aimed at Google, Apple, Amazon, approved

#170

Post by iasay »

Gareth321 wrote: post #20
rvschuilenburg wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This almost sounds too good to be true. What are the odds of this being watered down, or being delayed into eternity?

IMHO, extremely low. The DMA has passed final debate and review, so it's not changing now. The last step is basically a formality. The beauty of the EU is that corporate financial influence is far less pervasive than even in the governments of member nations. The level of abstraction is just too large. Apple, Google, Amazon, et al., can wage a PR campaign, but it's highly unlikely to succeed.

I think you are completely mad if thy think that corporate financial influence is far less. Where do you think the EU staff come from?

What happens is you are promoted out of the corporate world and into EU council advisory positions (special advisors). So you end up a fill time EU advisory position with part time and contract work for your parent company. Or there's the full time corporate advisors (institutional special advisors)!

Some are academically sourced and the universities are usually bankrolled by corporations who are just buying advisory positions.

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