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U.S. News pulls Columbia University from its 2022 rankings

forbes.com

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Re: U.S. News pulls Columbia University from its 2022 rankings

#311

Post by kristopolous »

UncleOxidant wrote: post #112
dwater wrote: post #29

For context, U.S. News and World Report used to be a trusted periodical that reported national and international news. In the 80's they started ranking colleges and selling it as a separate publication, which turned out to be pretty profitable, so they repeated the trick by ranking hospitals (1990), cars (2007), and then states (2017). The news business went online only in 2011, then shuttered in 2015. Since then the…

U.S. News and World Report was a highly respected & trusted news magazine in the 70s-90s, but it's online incarnation now is just another clickbait site (similar for Newsweek).

I remember reading the paper magazine for school in the 1990s. Teachers would assign parts as homework sometimes. It was on that level of trusted journalism

I don't know what the equivalent today would be. The Reuters website maybe?

Re: U.S. News pulls Columbia University from its 2022 rankings

#312

Post by WillPostForFood »

dataphyte wrote: post #2

US colleges foresee a future where they are under attack for being absurdly selective, what some are now calling being "highly rejective". I think they want to avoid being targeted by the fairness wonks anymore than they already are. Also, US News and World Report rankings have major problems, for instance, the ranking algorithm considers campus aesthetics and food quality, but doesn't account for price, giving schoo…

US News rankings considers neither food nor campus aesthetics.

https://www.usnews.com/education/best-colleges/articles/rank...

Re: U.S. News pulls Columbia University from its 2022 rankings

#313

Post by WillPostForFood »

peanuty1 wrote: post #34
dataphyte wrote: post #2

US colleges foresee a future where they are under attack for being absurdly selective, what some are now calling being "highly rejective". I think they want to avoid being targeted by the fairness wonks anymore than they already are. Also, US News and World Report rankings have major problems, for instance, the ranking algorithm considers campus aesthetics and food quality, but doesn't account for price, giving schoo…

> the ranking algorithm considers campus aesthetics and food quality. wtf

It is not true.

https://www.usnews.com/education/best-colleges/articles/rank...

Re: U.S. News pulls Columbia University from its 2022 rankings

#314

Post by caddemon »

throwaway2037 wrote: post #124
kaesar14 wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Was it that hard to read and get my alma mater right? ;) In my opinion as a student who entered Northeastern in the mid 2010's the answer to all your questions is an unequivocal yes. More competitive student body, better profile to attract employers, more student amenities to enhance on campus life (we could have more in this regard imho). Compared to the commuter school of yesteryear it's for sure a much better educ…

"better profile to attract employers" -- this is very important in the United States. If you are good student from a below average university, your job prospects are /much/ worse!

I actually think that Northeastern is really good at this even relative to its current peers in the rankings. I have no affiliation but just being around the Boston area I hear many good things about their co-op program.

Re: U.S. News pulls Columbia University from its 2022 rankings

#315

Post by WillPostForFood »

fsckboy wrote: post #286

misleading headline (on the original article) from TFA: "on Thursday of last week, just before the July 1 deadline for submitting new data to U.S. News... Provost Mary Boyce, said [Columbia] would not submit data this year, adding that the university had “embarked on a review of our data collection and submissions process” and that is why they will not be in the rankings. It seems Forbes filled out this submission ju…

The article is correct. US News kicked Columbia out of the 2022 rankings. Columbia subsequently withdrew from submitting data for the 2023 rankings.

Re: U.S. News pulls Columbia University from its 2022 rankings

#316

Post by caddemon »

whimsicalism wrote: post #138
lpolovets wrote: post #65

The influence of US News on colleges is wild. One absurd tidbit that I've heard: the rankings weigh freshman stats much more than transfer student stats, so a lot of competitive schools that won't let you in as a freshman if you would hurt their SAT/GPA/etc averages will happily let you in as a transfer because they'll make more revenue and your stats no longer hurt their rankings. * The ranking formula is also chang…

Depends on the school. At a place like Harvard or Yale it is incredibly difficult to get in as a transfer, much harder than to get in in the first place.

Yeah but that's Tier 0, it's not surprising that HYPSM don't feel the need to engage in as many number fudging tactics. It's a lot more impactful to Tier 1 top schools (e.g. a Dartmouth) where USN ranks them.

Re: U.S. News pulls Columbia University from its 2022 rankings

#317

Post by whimsicalism »

frognumber wrote: post #288
whimsicalism wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think Stanford is viewed as having eclipsed Yale and is competitive with Harvard. Princeton probably also eclipses Yale.

Insider who worked with a lot of schools: Yale is a much, much better school than Stanford. Stanford beats Yale on hype. A lot of the elites are hype-over-substance, and it's often hard for a naive audience to screen out which ones.

Stanford certainly beats Yale in CS quality both in terms of peers and instruction.

I have significant experience with HYP, less-so with Stanford. I don't think I am a naive audience, I know many people from these schools and have attended classes, either due to being a student there or online videos in the case of Stanford & Princeton.

Re: U.S. News pulls Columbia University from its 2022 rankings

#318

Post by gofreddygo »

bdowling wrote: post #247
gofreddygo wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Funny how this reminded me of a PG essay[1] The most damaging thing you learned in school wasn't something you learned in any specific class. It was learning to get good grades. [1]: http://paulgraham.com/lesson.html

The problem with that quote is that if you don't learn to get good grades (e.g., because you are actually learning and not studying for the test), then the resulting bad grades can be extremely damaging to your future.

Its title says "UN"learn. Suggesting it is learned by default for a student.

Going to college optimizing for "learning" and to gyms for "fitness" are poor use of time and resources.

The essay is just pointing out that strategy to hack tests for grades stops working. You need to improv on it in startup land or in the kingdoms of BigCo.

Re: U.S. News pulls Columbia University from its 2022 rankings

#319

Post by Ice_cream_suit »

"The picture coming into focus is that of a two-tier university, which educates, side by side in the same classrooms, two large and quite distinct groups of undergraduates: non-transfer students and transfer students.

The former students lead privileged lives: they are very selectively chosen, boast top-notch test scores, tend to hail from the wealthier ranks of society, receive ample financial aid, and turn out very successfully as measured by graduation rates.

The latter students are significantly worse off: they are less selectively chosen, typically have lower test scores (one surmises, although acceptance rates and average test scores for the Combined Plan and General Studies are well-kept secrets),43 tend to come from less prosperous backgrounds (as their higher rate of Pell grants shows), receive much stingier financial aid, and have considerably more difficulty graduating.

No one would design a university this way, but it has been the status quo at Columbia for years. The situation is tolerated only because it is not widely understood. "

https://www.math.columbia.edu/~thaddeus/ranking/investigatio...

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