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Transport System Bögl: a new magnetic rail system

transportsystemboegl.com

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Re: Transport System Bögl: a new magnetic rail system

#41

Post by usrusr »

ucosty wrote: post #22

Another day, another gadgetbahn. It's hard to tell from their website exactly what problems they're trying to solve. They seem to have taken all of the worst aspects of monorail style operations, the relative complexity of maglev, and the vendor lock-in of a gadgetbahn and have just run with it. Off the top of my head: From their rolling (gliding?) stock concepts it looks like they're targeting the automated metro sy…

My sarcastic take: the problem they are trying to solve is that they are earning a lot of money from contracts so large that so few competitors remain that it becomes somewhat "taking candy from a baby" and that makes them desperately look for something to be proud of.

On the less sarcastic side: unlike the major partners in the former Transrapid project (Siemens and whatever the current incarnation of Thyssen was called at the time), they aren't a public company but some kind of family estate foundation. That type of organization has far more liberty to follow vanity projects than anything pubic could ever dream of.

Re: Transport System Bögl: a new magnetic rail system

#42

Post by Shadonototra »

schroeding wrote: post #40
Shadonototra wrote: post #2

Nice, but it looks ugly AF, it feels very "industrial" I can't imagine this in the middle of EU architecture Or in the middle of Asian temples, or in the middle of a beautiful landscape They really need better designers Also the front doesn't look like aerodynamic

I think it looks quite fitting between boxy European[1] or Asian[2] rail cars. :D [1] https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:1019_4-Gleisdreieck-... [2] https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Model_1000_of_Odakyu...

they are very ugly

an example of what's beautiful and modern design (imo) is the Tram in Bordeaux, France

https://www.alstom.com/fr/press-releases-news/2020/2/alstom-...

https://i.redd.it/fbl047w3qdpy.jpg

https://static.actu.fr/uploads/2020/07/tramway-bordeaux-854x...

Re: Transport System Bögl: a new magnetic rail system

#43

Post by schroeding »

Shadonototra wrote: post #42
schroeding wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it looks quite fitting between boxy European[1] or Asian[2] rail cars. :D [1] https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:1019_4-Gleisdreieck-... [2] https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Model_1000_of_Odakyu...

they are very ugly an example of what's beautiful and modern design (imo) is the Tram in Bordeaux, France https://www.alstom.com/fr/press-releases-news/2020/2/alstom-... https://i.redd.it/fbl047w3qdpy.jpg https://static.actu.fr/uploads/2020/07/tramway-bordeaux-854x...

I agree, but that's the boxy Euro-Asian reality, for years to come. So it can't get much worse. :D

Re: Transport System Bögl: a new magnetic rail system

#44

Post by mschuster91 »

schroeding wrote: post #38
mschuster91 wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Edmund Stoiber's infamous 10 minute speech killed the Transrapid in Munich. One of the OG German memes.

For the uninitiated: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f7TboWvVERU Context: The old munich airport in Riem was closed in the 90s. The new airport was very far away. Gadgetbahn Transrapid, running through tunnels and above the remains of the old olympia train line from '72, should save the day. MP Stoiber tries to explain the advantages. Translation: If you start from the main station in Munich with 10 minutes, without…

Good lord, you actually managed to listen to and translate it without falling apart laughing? tips hat

Re: Transport System Bögl: a new magnetic rail system

#45

Post by usr1106 »

mschuster91 wrote: post #44
schroeding wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For the uninitiated: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f7TboWvVERU Context: The old munich airport in Riem was closed in the 90s. The new airport was very far away. Gadgetbahn Transrapid, running through tunnels and above the remains of the old olympia train line from '72, should save the day. MP Stoiber tries to explain the advantages. Translation: If you start from the main station in Munich with 10 minutes, without…

Good lord, you actually managed to listen to and translate it without falling apart laughing? tips hat

Munich has been considered one of the leading engineering centers in Germany for a long time. (Maybe Berlin has passed it now when you focus more on software startups.) How the heck have they had the worst politicians In Germany (well, probably only second worst in post fact age) for decades?

Re: Transport System Bögl: a new magnetic rail system

#46

Post by mecha_ghidorah »

bluGill wrote: post #29
vosper wrote: post #4

I looked at the site, I can’t tell what’s new about it. Kinda looks like less-grimy BART to me, and that’s hardly modern. Does anyone know more about what’s innovative here?

marketing, like most gadgetbahns. There is a reason transit enthusiasts in general look down on this. Anyone who knows something about how to run trains knows this at best done nothing to solve the real problems facing transit, and most likely if they get even one sale it makes things worse for everyone.

I'd be interested to read more about the actual problems and how maglev trains might make them worse. Not that I don't believe you, but it seems counterintuitive and I'm curious now

Re: Transport System Bögl: a new magnetic rail system

#47

Post by albertopv »

rob74 wrote: post #24
cgeier wrote: post #11

This is very similar to existing maglev trains (such as transrapid) but has the advantage that a lot of the technology is now in the trains, not in the track. That makes construction of such tracks a lot cheaper (but separate and new tracks are needed anyway). Also, this new system is designed for cruising speeds of up to 150 km/h (instead of 500 km/h). But in addition to passenger transport, they seem to be able to…

The question in my mind is just: if not for higher speeds, why should you build a maglev line instead of a conventional (high speed / regular) train line? IMHO the other purported advantages are not really convincing - it may be a little bit quieter, but the "flexible track routing" sounds very unconvincing: at ground level you would have to fence off the track, so in an urban setting it would probably end up on stil…

I live near a railway where over 100 trains pass every day, most are freight ones. They are very, very noisy, even a small reduction could help when these lines are within cities.

Re: Transport System Bögl: a new magnetic rail system

#48

Post by mschuster91 »

usr1106 wrote: post #45
mschuster91 wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Good lord, you actually managed to listen to and translate it without falling apart laughing? tips hat

Munich has been considered one of the leading engineering centers in Germany for a long time. (Maybe Berlin has passed it now when you focus more on software startups.) How the heck have they had the worst politicians In Germany (well, probably only second worst in post fact age) for decades?

Because the rest of Bavaria's populations is... let's just keep it at "Bavaria is the Texas of Germany".

Braindeadly conservative folks outside of Munich and the other population centers.

Re: Transport System Bögl: a new magnetic rail system

#49

Post by bluGill »

mecha_ghidorah wrote: post #46
bluGill wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

marketing, like most gadgetbahns. There is a reason transit enthusiasts in general look down on this. Anyone who knows something about how to run trains knows this at best done nothing to solve the real problems facing transit, and most likely if they get even one sale it makes things worse for everyone.

I'd be interested to read more about the actual problems and how maglev trains might make them worse. Not that I don't believe you, but it seems counterintuitive and I'm curious now

The biggest problems is the high cost of building track. Remember that trains do not cover everything, so you have to pay for roads (though in the most transit friendly places the few trucks that are needed drive on the sidewalks next to pedestrians no problem). Automated rail is the cheapest to operate, but there are very high upfront costs that may never be paid for compared to running a bus. (when self driving cars arrive I look forward to self driving buses - they would solve something like 75% of what I'm looking to a train for)

standardization is a very useful thing in the world. Standards mean you can buy from many different suppliers - if one train manufacture is busy find a different. Standards also mean you can share track with different lines spreading construction costs out. (this even includes freight trains) Standards mean manufactures can invest in jigs that are not worth building for custom things that nobody else needs - or worth building but the cost of the jig is spread out across more parts. One special case of a jig is a long assembly line - note that a modern car is very complex and yet new they start at only $16,000. While trains will never be in high enough demand to get that cheap, there is a lot of opportunity to lower costs if only there were more orders of the same thing (like cars you can choose what color paint you want and a few other options)

Re: Transport System Bögl: a new magnetic rail system

#50

Post by LargoLasskhyfv »

PinguTS wrote: post #18

We should not forget the backstory of this company. Max Bögel is the largest family-owned construction company in Germany. They build mainly infrastructure like roads, but where also involved in the Gigafactory in Grünheide in Germany. So, for them its a new business unit to build more infrastructure as a whole contractor. They can delivery everything, not like it is today in infrastructure projects where you have ma…

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