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University Profs' Criticism Led to Retraction of Math Paper on Gender (2018)

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Re: University Profs' Criticism Led to Retraction of Math Paper on Gender (2018)

#21

Post by [deleted] »

civilized wrote: post #11
defrost wrote: post #2

The paper itself is a chuckle fest (as are many Intelligencer submissions) and concludes: > The goal here has been neither to challenge nor to confirm Darwin’s and other researchers’ observations of greater male variability for any given species or any given trait, but rather to propose an elementary mathematical theory based on biological/evolutionary mechanisms that might serve as a starting point to help explain h…

High-energy physicists make up theories for the mechanisms behind phenomena that may or may not even exist all the time. One can question the utility of this but no one strings up such authors for heresy.

[deleted]

Re: University Profs' Criticism Led to Retraction of Math Paper on Gender (2018)

#22

Post by RayVR »

defrost wrote: post #2

The paper itself is a chuckle fest (as are many Intelligencer submissions) and concludes: > The goal here has been neither to challenge nor to confirm Darwin’s and other researchers’ observations of greater male variability for any given species or any given trait, but rather to propose an elementary mathematical theory based on biological/evolutionary mechanisms that might serve as a starting point to help explain h…

uh...no. They are not stirring the pot. Proposing rigorous processes that approximate observed phenomena is a very common line of research. Many of the phenomena in financial markets that I cared about when I was trading had researchers coming up with models/modifying existing models to attempt to generate the same observed risk premia.

Re: University Profs' Criticism Led to Retraction of Math Paper on Gender (2018)

#24

Post by Ma8ee »

barrysteve wrote: post #18

According to a document drop publicly released on Retraction Watch, Senechal wrote to Hill and Tabachnikov, concerned about the “very real possibility that the right-wing media may pick [the article] up and hype it internationally.” She proposed a round-table discussion be held in lieu of publishing the paper, one that never occurred. I don't understand why the people involved would care if some political group picke…

Because you don’t want yourself or the journal your are editor for to be used as a weapon by right wing extremists (i.e. so called conservatives). Even if the research would be true and we could use the knowledge to improve society, the right wing will pick it up and use it to promote sexism and racism.

Re: University Profs' Criticism Led to Retraction of Math Paper on Gender (2018)

#25

Post by colechristensen »

barrysteve wrote: post #18

According to a document drop publicly released on Retraction Watch, Senechal wrote to Hill and Tabachnikov, concerned about the “very real possibility that the right-wing media may pick [the article] up and hype it internationally.” She proposed a round-table discussion be held in lieu of publishing the paper, one that never occurred. I don't understand why the people involved would care if some political group picke…

There was a very real possibility that political opponents would like the result of the paper.

Thus giving weight to the political opponents claims that academia has an unfair bias towards one political position and is willing to distort the truth to accommodate this bias.

I really don’t want academia to be driven by politics and shit like this retraction just encourages it.

Re: University Profs' Criticism Led to Retraction of Math Paper on Gender (2018)

#26

Post by zozbot234 »

Ma8ee wrote: post #24
barrysteve wrote: post #18

According to a document drop publicly released on Retraction Watch, Senechal wrote to Hill and Tabachnikov, concerned about the “very real possibility that the right-wing media may pick [the article] up and hype it internationally.” She proposed a round-table discussion be held in lieu of publishing the paper, one that never occurred. I don't understand why the people involved would care if some political group picke…

Because you don’t want yourself or the journal your are editor for to be used as a weapon by right wing extremists (i.e. so called conservatives). Even if the research would be true and we could use the knowledge to improve society, the right wing will pick it up and use it to promote sexism and racism.

Except that right wing trolls will pick up literally anything for their own purposes. Trying to avoid that by playing politics about scientific matters is a fool's game, it only compounds the problem further.

Re: University Profs' Criticism Led to Retraction of Math Paper on Gender (2018)

#27

Post by colechristensen »

Ma8ee wrote: post #24
barrysteve wrote: post #18

According to a document drop publicly released on Retraction Watch, Senechal wrote to Hill and Tabachnikov, concerned about the “very real possibility that the right-wing media may pick [the article] up and hype it internationally.” She proposed a round-table discussion be held in lieu of publishing the paper, one that never occurred. I don't understand why the people involved would care if some political group picke…

Because you don’t want yourself or the journal your are editor for to be used as a weapon by right wing extremists (i.e. so called conservatives). Even if the research would be true and we could use the knowledge to improve society, the right wing will pick it up and use it to promote sexism and racism.

And thus to degrade the sense that you’re working for truth instead of just your political agenda.

Re: University Profs' Criticism Led to Retraction of Math Paper on Gender (2018)

#28

Post by AinderS »

eska wrote: post #19
jacknews wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree, but it's not clear from the article if the paper is even wrong. As I understand it there's robust evidence in support of the hypothesis itself (GMVH), and this paper was an attempt to model how the effect could come about. It looks to me more like it was retracted for being distasteful to the journal editor's wife.

According to the author and a publisher no scientific criticism has been offered.

Suppose some had. Almost every paper has some shortcomings on which it can be validly criticized. But how much criticism those shortcomings generate, and if that criticism results in a retraction or academic censure, depends on if the paper dared to endanger any modern-day holy cows.

Re: University Profs' Criticism Led to Retraction of Math Paper on Gender (2018)

#29

Post by eesmith »

akomtu wrote: post #4

Scientists who studied in medieval times how many angels can fit a needle tip must have reincarnated and continued their research in an adjacent field.

> However, the idea that such questions had a prominent place in medieval scholarship has been debated, and it has not been proven that this particular question was ever disputed.[6] One theory is that it is an early modern fabrication,[a] used to discredit scholastic philosophy at a time when it still played a significant role in university education. - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/How_many_angels_can_dance_on_t...

Re: University Profs' Criticism Led to Retraction of Math Paper on Gender (2018)

#30

Post by waffleiron »

mgamache wrote: post #15

Retracting a paper should only be done in select situations, like fraud, plagiarism or violating ethical guidelines. Was any of that present? If you retract papers that were just 'wrong' you would be retracting at least 50% of the work published in a lot of fields. Furthermore you would leave a blind spot in the research, other researchers might try and pursue those retracted ideas not realizing they are dead ends.

Then you could as well argue peer review should not look at methodology, but only for fraud, plagiarism and ethics violations. A retraction can in some cases be seem as a delayed failed (broader) peer review.
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