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As TikTok grows, so does suspicion

economist.com

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Re: As TikTok grows, so does suspicion

#321

Post by sneak »

fardo wrote: post #298
colinsane wrote: post #279

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it is based on a simple idea - people will happily give away their data and privacy if you consistently entertain them. there’s the individual-level view, and the state-level view. i, as an individual, don’t really care if China has my location data or shopping data. what are they going to do with it? they can exert soft power over me: propaganda; distort my worldview a bit. meanwhile, if my own government has acce…

> meanwhile, if my own government has access to this same data, i suffer direct consequences. my odds of getting arrested for nonviolent crime (e.g. political activism; buying drugs online) go way up when my govt surveils me It seems like an error to assume these two forms of surveillance are mutually exclusive. At any of > the Starbucks you’re using for free wifi > the ISP your endpoint is using for internet access…

Almost all APIs are TLS-encrypted these days, leaking only the hostname to which the client is connecting (via SNI which is as yet unencrypted).

This is not to say you're not being surveilled (as to which apps you use, etc) but there is relatively little unencrypted traffic coming out of most devices in 2022.

Re: As TikTok grows, so does suspicion

#322

Post by AlexandrB »

joeman1000 wrote: post #189

It’s a subversive platform. It quickly profiles someone and begins serving them mind-altering content. Content which will change someone’s perception, behaviour and world-view. Part of its power is our new belief in the transcendental nature of ‘the algorithm’. People believe they ‘should’ be viewing the content that TikTok serves to them, so the messages in the content are more potent. When you put this limbic weapo…

Your first paragraph describes Instagram's algorithmic feed or YouTube suggestions just as well. The original sin IMHO is not killing algorithmic feeds in the crib with regulation. I don't get how companies can continue to claim immunity from liability under section 230 when they actively curate user feeds to maximize their commercial interests.

Re: As TikTok grows, so does suspicion

#323

Post by alexashka »

tonymet wrote: post #5

they mention data harvesting and influencing public relations as risks, and both are worrisome . another more subtle but pernicious concern is the trivialization of entertainment (which started from a low bar ) tiktok is addictive and much of the content is low bar , slapstick and sexually suggestive thirst traps . there may be a good share of high quality content , but we all know time spent is on garbage. our grand…

Isn't this exactly what they said about porn?

Last I checked - everyone's doing alright.

Re: As TikTok grows, so does suspicion

#324

Post by random314 »

illuminati1911 wrote: post #311
fabianhjr wrote: post #262

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Russian Federation != Union of Soviet Socialist Republics More so: Russian Federation != Russian Soviet Federative Socialist Republic

USA during Reagan in 1980s != USA today

However the firm grip on Haiti and Latin America in general is not gone.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jean-Bertrand_Aristide

Re: As TikTok grows, so does suspicion

#325

Post by bastawhiz »

cruano wrote: post #294
EamonnMR wrote: post #232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

TikTok's format is more successful at micro targeting and influencing people than Facebook. Other future social media networks will probably work in a similar way and be just as concerning. YouTube is another one that's very good at influencing people. I wonder if video is unsafe at any speed, so to speak... A spooky example of TikTok-the-emergent-system's ability to influence people at scale. This one gave me pause.…

Influencing sure, but espionage ? From what I can tell, people mostly consume content there in a similar fashion to YouTube, i.e. you don't really add your real-life friends and you don't post your day-to-day stuff unless you are already a celebrity Contrary to facebook where people would literally "Follow" their political parties, workplaces, friend groups from school/work/gym/life, etc.

Espionage for the sake of espionage isn't useful. But if you're collecting lots and lots of data about what people like and what makes them angry and you have a direct line to feed them whatever information you want, having tens of millions of targets for opinion-influencing content is a very powerful tool for a state actor.

Re: As TikTok grows, so does suspicion

#326

Post by Al-Khwarizmi »

illuminati1911 wrote: post #309
Al-Khwarizmi wrote: post #253

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You would be surprised if you polled non-US, non-China citizens about what country is the biggest geopolitical threat to the world. Wait, I don't even need to talk in conditionals. I Googled it and apparently it has indeed been done several times, and the results are what I expected. https://brilliantmaps.com/threat-to-peace/ https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/may/05/us-threat-demo...

Quoted post unavailable.

You call the overwhelming majority of the world population unwashed savages whose opinion must be disregarded, and then sit there in disbelief that most people might dislike see your country (of which, sadly, that attitude is quite representative) as a threat.

It would be good parody if it weren't real.

Re: As TikTok grows, so does suspicion

#327

Post by justinpowers »

madeofpalk wrote: post #216
mkl95 wrote: post #212

TikTok is the most successful espionage operation of the 21st century so far, and it is based on a simple idea - people will happily give away their data and privacy if you consistently entertain them. In my opinion the application should be shut down as soon as possible, but there are many lessons to learn from it. And most of them have little to do with technology.

As a non-US, non-Chinese citizen, is there something that makes TikTok espionage and Facebook not? Or is it just "china scary"?

This whole thread is equivalent to two people on opposite sides of the Earth arguing about whether the sun will be rising or setting.

Just go buy some sunscreen already.

Re: As TikTok grows, so does suspicion

#328

Post by random314 »

konschubert wrote: post #268
Al-Khwarizmi wrote: post #253

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You would be surprised if you polled non-US, non-China citizens about what country is the biggest geopolitical threat to the world. Wait, I don't even need to talk in conditionals. I Googled it and apparently it has indeed been done several times, and the results are what I expected. https://brilliantmaps.com/threat-to-peace/ https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/may/05/us-threat-demo...

okay, go poll Ukrainians, Poles, Czechs, ...

And latin America and Afghanistan and Iraq and cuba and Vietnam and Palestine and Yemen

Re: As TikTok grows, so does suspicion

#329

Post by 1337biz »

jacooper wrote: post #141
winternett wrote: post #22

I don't think it's the privacy issues that will defeat TikTok, I think it's the deception of a success economy being possible on the platform. In the past few weeks I've been observing a lot of marginal content trending on the platform which indicates to me that a lot of the more quality posters aren't posting new content. The minute quality creators leave a platform is the minute it dies. TikTok has not really been…

> The minute quality creators leave a platform is the minute it dies. TikTok has not really been rewarding creators fairly, and pushes the idea that organic growth is possible, and that people have become really successful, but many creators realize after months of working for little to no reward that it's a false narrative. I heard the opposite story from 2 creators in my local language. Their growth on Tiktok is cr…

I noticed a similar narrative and noticed it even first hand on some accounts I am following on Instagram which only recently started moving to TikTok. The growth is insane. Comedians with something like 10k followers on Instagram getting 1-2m views on their TikToks in their first few vids. But they are fully adjusting to the TikTok format and dynamic.

On instagram I am increasingly seeing ads for popular sports and music stars - which I would suspect could be triggered by unsatisfying reach or growth for them and Instagram cutting down even more on free exposure.

If TikTok can sustain a mechanism that boosts new creators it will be golden for a long time. Organic growth seems to be dead for Instagram and YouTube unless someone puts in 10x the effort than for TikTok.

Re: As TikTok grows, so does suspicion

#330

Post by jes »

phyrex wrote: post #261
shikoba wrote: post #217

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is because China is the enemy. When it's Facebook or Google strangely it's never an issue. Moral is always a facade for international economic war. And some people fall for it.

How are they “The Enemy”? Are they coming and killing Americans or is it just generic xenophobia?

I found this[1] report (PDF) from the DEA:

"Currently, China remains the primary source of fentanyl and fentanyl-related substances trafficked through international mail and express consignment operations environment, as well as the main source for all fentanyl-related substances trafficked into the United States. Seizures of fentanyl sourced from China average less than one kilogram in weight, and often test above 90 percent concentration of pure fentanyl."

Presumably, if the CCP wanted to do so, they could put an end to the groups shipping this deadly substance into the United States.

1. https://tinyurl.com/4396s38r

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