Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Element (Matrix) launches Chatterbox, end-to-end encrypted embedded chat

element.io

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

41–50 of 93 posts

Re: Element (Matrix) launches Chatterbox, end-to-end encrypted embedded chat

#41

Post by NoraCodes »

29083011397778 wrote: post #21
ngetchell wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How about slow compared to Discord?

But this still doesn't answer the question - did you register on the default server that everyone uses (matrix.org)? And in that case, you've given the exact worse case scenario: The heaviest server, being used by everyone else, with massive rooms, and constantly fighting off spam.

Not everyone uses matrix.org. I've run my own server on a $15/mo DO droplet for ages and my whole polycule and friend group use it heavily as well. It's incredibly easy to deploy and maintain for anyone who knows even a little bit about sysadmin.

Re: Element (Matrix) launches Chatterbox, end-to-end encrypted embedded chat

#42

Post by t6jvcereio »

jeroenhd wrote: post #24
t6jvcereio wrote: post #8

Incidentally I tried matrix for the first time on the basis of someone recommending it here in HN, and it's extremely slow

I'm running it on my own server and performance is quite acceptable. Picking the right client is very important, though; Element isn't always the fastest, and I find Cinny's UX to be much better for general chat, which is clearly very much… inspired by Discord. On the other hand, Element is ahead in terms of features and protocol support (like the (live) location sharing feature), but Fluffychat has the superior mobi…

I'm not sure the problem was the client (element for Android). Asking around it seems people on the chatrooms kind of agreed the issue was matrix.org

Regardless, if you believe the issue is the client, which would you recommend is the lightest/fastest client?

Re: Element (Matrix) launches Chatterbox, end-to-end encrypted embedded chat

#43

Post by woojoo666 »

lawl wrote: post #37
woojoo666 wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the business doesn't want to host the chat server themselves, they can have a 3rd party provider host it (like Matrix.org) without worrying about the 3rd party having access to the messages Edit: sorry I should have clarified that I was answering your second question. As for the first question, the user still has to trust the business to a certain extent

But they host the software, you already have to trust them. This threat model just does not make sense.

The user has to trust the business no matter what. Even if the chat was e2e encrypted, the business could just choose to share the messages with somebody else.

This use case is more for the business, who knows that the chat is hosted by a 3rd party, but is reassured that the 3rd party wont have access to messages.

Re: Element (Matrix) launches Chatterbox, end-to-end encrypted embedded chat

#44

Post by kixiQu »

NoraCodes wrote: post #41
29083011397778 wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But this still doesn't answer the question - did you register on the default server that everyone uses (matrix.org)? And in that case, you've given the exact worse case scenario: The heaviest server, being used by everyone else, with massive rooms, and constantly fighting off spam.

Not everyone uses matrix.org. I've run my own server on a $15/mo DO droplet for ages and my whole polycule and friend group use it heavily as well. It's incredibly easy to deploy and maintain for anyone who knows even a little bit about sysadmin.

same. i have yet to bother switching from sqlite to postgres and it's ... fine. it's fine.

Re: Element (Matrix) launches Chatterbox, end-to-end encrypted embedded chat

#45

Post by woojoo666 »

bsaul wrote: post #9

not sure i understand what the point is.. Embedded usually means c2b communication, not c2c. The professional you're communicating with is probably already hosting its computer's data on the company's network...

This could be useful for smaller business that don't want to maintain their own servers. Element already provides hosting services for Matrix chat [1]. Businesses can use it, without worrying about messages being exposed to the hosting service.

[1]: https://element.io/matrix-services

Re: Element (Matrix) launches Chatterbox, end-to-end encrypted embedded chat

#46

Post by woojoo666 »

encryptluks2 wrote: post #33
Legogris wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not the person you're replying to but following up on an identical past thread: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30996203 > Linux, x86_64. Getting the same behavior across distros and installations. It is still very much the case. To emphasize, we have for the past couple of years used Matrix routinely on: * Multiple client implementations * Multiple OSs (Linux/Android/iOS) * Multiple accounts and profiles * Mult…

Probably because the app is a bloated piece of junk

A sibling comment [1] says it works fine on Mac and Windows, and it's all the same desktop app. It's likely a Linux quirk that hasn't gotten enough attention yet

[1]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32021303

Re: Element (Matrix) launches Chatterbox, end-to-end encrypted embedded chat

#47

Post by woojoo666 »

Pakdef wrote: post #35
jeroenhd wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

With E2EE I don't think you can even implement a reliable export on the server side. It seems like Element is limited to only exporting a single room, though. You need something like https://gitlab.com/argit/matrix-recorder/ to export all messages, it seems.

> With E2EE I don't think you can even implement a reliable export on the server side. Can't you use your client key(s)?

The client would have to fetch all your messages first. Some rooms can have thousands of messages a day, and some people are in thousands of rooms [1] (though these are core developers so they might be stress testing)

[1]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32021303

Re: Element (Matrix) launches Chatterbox, end-to-end encrypted embedded chat

#49

Post by ldkdndsl »

Arathorn wrote: post #11
t6jvcereio wrote: post #8

Incidentally I tried matrix for the first time on the basis of someone recommending it here in HN, and it's extremely slow

this is like saying “i tried the web, and it’s extremely slow”. what server were you using? and which client on which platform?

No post body was provided.

Re: Element (Matrix) launches Chatterbox, end-to-end encrypted embedded chat

#50

Post by ldldldjsnd »

t6jvcereio wrote: post #42
jeroenhd wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm running it on my own server and performance is quite acceptable. Picking the right client is very important, though; Element isn't always the fastest, and I find Cinny's UX to be much better for general chat, which is clearly very much… inspired by Discord. On the other hand, Element is ahead in terms of features and protocol support (like the (live) location sharing feature), but Fluffychat has the superior mobi…

I'm not sure the problem was the client (element for Android). Asking around it seems people on the chatrooms kind of agreed the issue was matrix.org Regardless, if you believe the issue is the client, which would you recommend is the lightest/fastest client?

The problem of slow joins isn't the client, it's the protocol. Just join the Synapse admins channel on matrix.org (will take half an hour to load, your client will time out and give you an error but it will load eventually) and the other admins will tell you they're all aware of the problem.

Shocking to see Arathorn deflecting about this. I run a server and just never use federation to avoid the problem.

Not sure why I keep getting flagged

Post reply on HN