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LeCun's 2022 paper on autonomous machine intelligence does not cite prior work

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Re: LeCun's 2022 paper on autonomous machine intelligence does not cite prior work

#31

Post by carapace »

I recall watching a video of Schmidhuber presenting. He comes onstage, introduces himself, and then makes a joke. ("You again!") It's a funny joke. And it's self-deprecating. I remember thinking to myself, "This is a formidable Austrian." That and the Gödelmachine: I'm a fan.

There's a simple and obvious way to solve this: cite the papers. It's traditional, it's noble, it's not hard, and it makes you look good.

I mentioned a couple of weeks ago something I learned reading an old interview by Bill Moyers of Isaac Asimov, that in ~1900 three different people, Hugo de Vries, Carl Correns, and Erich Tschermak von Seysenegg, discovered the laws of genetics, checked the literature, and found the work of Mendel from half a century earlier. Each of them credited Mendel.

Re: LeCun's 2022 paper on autonomous machine intelligence does not cite prior work

#33

Post by civilized »

arcanus wrote: post #11
going_ham wrote: post #4

It's him again. That must be enough to give context on who I am talking about. I do not know what to tell about him. Sure he has explored a lot of topic and never got the limelight like others. But I think it's time for him to stop gaslighting about other researchers just because they didn't cite his papers. Sure, they could have never read it. He can make his work shout by publishing better papers and better design.…

We are scientists and can use names. 'him' is Jürgen Schmidhuber. He's a luminary of ML, but he has entered into several attribution controversies. He famously accused Ian Goodfellow of appropriating his work to create generative adversarial networks (GANs) in a public venue (a NeurIPS workshop). I agree with the parent comment. Ultimately, Science is about advancing the human condition more than celebrating great in…

I know Schmidhuber is an important figure in deep learning and I barely know anything about deep learning. The guy is on top of the world and could find better things to do than whine.

Re: LeCun's 2022 paper on autonomous machine intelligence does not cite prior work

#34

Post by vannevar »

AbrahamParangi wrote: post #25
swayvil wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"intrinsic objectives" and "hard-wired programs" sound alike. Given that both must be designed.

Meaning with defined goals (intrinsic objectives) instead of defined operations (hard-wired programs).

Once you've committed to performing an operation it becomes a goal. As the old saying goes, it's turtles all the way down...

Re: LeCun's 2022 paper on autonomous machine intelligence does not cite prior work

#35

Post by IfOnlyYouKnew »

harveywi wrote: post #32

lecuna (noun): An empty space in a list of citations where the works of Jürgen Schmidhuber should appear.

This is somewhat funny and very smart and can only be downvoted by people who don’t speak fluent Latin.

Re: LeCun's 2022 paper on autonomous machine intelligence does not cite prior work

#36

Post by IfOnlyYouKnew »

seydor wrote: post #12

Lecun's post is not even a paper as stated in the foreward of the paper. But thanks for bringing it up, i will read it > This document is not a technical nor scholarly paper in the traditional sense, but a position paper expressing my vision for a path towards intelligent machines that learn more like animals and humans, that can reason and plan, and whose behavior is driven by intrinsic objectives, rather than by ha…

Well you can’t just state “this isn’t a paper” at a beginning of a paper to get an exemption from the rules and traditions of scientific discourse. It’s like the people believing it’s not a crime to pay with counterfeit money if the signature reads “Donald Duck”.

Re: LeCun's 2022 paper on autonomous machine intelligence does not cite prior work

#38

Post by seydor »

IfOnlyYouKnew wrote: post #36
seydor wrote: post #12

Lecun's post is not even a paper as stated in the foreward of the paper. But thanks for bringing it up, i will read it > This document is not a technical nor scholarly paper in the traditional sense, but a position paper expressing my vision for a path towards intelligent machines that learn more like animals and humans, that can reason and plan, and whose behavior is driven by intrinsic objectives, rather than by ha…

Well you can’t just state “this isn’t a paper” at a beginning of a paper to get an exemption from the rules and traditions of scientific discourse. It’s like the people believing it’s not a crime to pay with counterfeit money if the signature reads “Donald Duck”.

It s not the same at all. You can make a blog post or an HN comment, or really anything and put it out there without following the rules of science journals. This is the essentially a blog post in PDF

Re: LeCun's 2022 paper on autonomous machine intelligence does not cite prior work

#40

Post by seydor »

alphabetting wrote: post #13

background from the great Genius Makers history of ML: The press needed heroes for its AI narrative. It chose Hinton, LeCun, Bengio, and sometimes Ng, thanks largely to the promotional efforts of Google and Facebook. The narrative did not extend to Jürgen Schmidhuber, the German researcher based on Lake Lugano who carried the torch for neural networks in Europe during the 1990s and 2000s. Some took issue with Schmidh…

Anyone who had a passing interest in ANNs in the 90s would not miss Hinton or Sejnowski or older work of Rosenblatt or Kohonen etc. They are a different league. TBH i did not encounter schmidhuber or bengio or lecun (the latter only in passing)
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