>Let’s walk through a couple theoretical scenarios where a subset of malicious validators wants to censor transactions, say those originating in FATF-blacklisted countries. Hang on a second. Just to be clear about this example, this example is walking through how Ethereum has been designed specifically to allow North Korea to transact Ethereum, and more than that, prevent anyone who dissents. Like, I mean ok, I get t…
Did you just assume that Etherium is American?
Ethereum Proof-of-Stake
91–100 of 338 posts
Re: Ethereum Proof-of-Stake
#92I can't see governments allowing PoW to continue to exist in our current climate (in all senses). How would Bitcoin ever move over to PoS like this? Would it just be a Bitcoin hard fork?
> governments allowing PoW Is there any precedent for this? Have governments ever ruled on how people can use their computational power?
Re: Ethereum Proof-of-Stake
#93Earlier quoted context omitted.
The spec is open and documented pretty clearly.[1] [1] https://notes.ethereum.org/@vbuterin/Sys3GLJbD#Misc
That's just a random function description. The main thing here is how is seed calculated and analysis of whether it seed is safe from network partition, DDoS, malicious attack, nodes being offline, forks etc.
[1] https://eth2book.info/altair/part2/building_blocks/randomnes...
[2] https://eth2.incessant.ink/book/06__building-blocks/02__rand...
Re: Ethereum Proof-of-Stake
#94I can't see governments allowing PoW to continue to exist in our current climate (in all senses). How would Bitcoin ever move over to PoS like this? Would it just be a Bitcoin hard fork?
Current Bitcoin usage is literally a rounding error of global energy usage (0.1%) and if wildly successful would still be https://www.lynalden.com/bitcoin-energy/ If Bitcoin moved to PoS it would be fundamentally different. It might work for other coins since they aren't as decentralized. > Instead, proof-of-stake mainly seems less suitable for a decentralized and censorship-resistant global monetary asset, especiall…
Re: Ethereum Proof-of-Stake
#95>Let’s walk through a couple theoretical scenarios where a subset of malicious validators wants to censor transactions, say those originating in FATF-blacklisted countries. Hang on a second. Just to be clear about this example, this example is walking through how Ethereum has been designed specifically to allow North Korea to transact Ethereum, and more than that, prevent anyone who dissents. Like, I mean ok, I get t…
Yes, if you actively and knowing break the law, you might get punished for it. Not sure what's new here? If you don't want to connect to North Korea, block connections coming from North Korea, it's like one or two commands of iptables.
I don't think "but I didn't know that it was a NK wallet!" is going to hold up in court either. There are laws regulating the minimum Know-Your-Customer a money transmitting company needs to perform and when the regulators come knocking you need to be able to show your procedures for that and how they lead to compliance with the law.
The real question is whether courts will rule that POS validators are "money transmitters" in a legal sense. To me it's kinda obvious that they are, since without the action of the validators no money would get transmitted. No doubt there will be much water under the bridge before that gets settled though.
Re: Ethereum Proof-of-Stake
#96Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yes, if you actively and knowing break the law, you might get punished for it. Not sure what's new here? If you don't want to connect to North Korea, block connections coming from North Korea, it's like one or two commands of iptables.
Ignorance of the law is not a valid defense. It might get you a lighter sentience, but don't count on that. You are expected to know all the laws that apply to all the activities you do.
Re: Ethereum Proof-of-Stake
#97Earlier quoted context omitted.
Well, the problem with this is that the misinformation stays around, influencing future discussions when it comes up again, when people keep repeating the same thing over and over. It would be more interesting to discuss new flaws in the protocol, or things that generally haven't been discussed before.
Do you think that I mean direct influence? that they can reprogram contracts? Don't straw man me. Large miners do have power, the power to destabilize the system. The same power large POW syndicates have that delays POS will be there in POS only in a more direct literal way. What do you think will happen if a more decentralized verification system will be proposed once there are people and institutions that will have…
How is a system that allows people with ~$30k to have any type of influence worse than the status quo?
Re: Ethereum Proof-of-Stake
#98>Let’s walk through a couple theoretical scenarios where a subset of malicious validators wants to censor transactions, say those originating in FATF-blacklisted countries. Hang on a second. Just to be clear about this example, this example is walking through how Ethereum has been designed specifically to allow North Korea to transact Ethereum, and more than that, prevent anyone who dissents. Like, I mean ok, I get t…
On the other hand, North Korea is the way it is because they've rejected our neo-liberal ideology. I think much like TOR did for Iraq this would actually move them away from China and closer to us. EDIT (out of comment quota): I'd hope not but I'm not convinced they aren't. It sure seems to degenerate into that more often than not.
I don't think the dystopic human torture camps are a necessary part of "rejecting the neo-liberal ideology".
Re: Ethereum Proof-of-Stake
#99Re: Ethereum Proof-of-Stake
#100>Let’s walk through a couple theoretical scenarios where a subset of malicious validators wants to censor transactions, say those originating in FATF-blacklisted countries. Hang on a second. Just to be clear about this example, this example is walking through how Ethereum has been designed specifically to allow North Korea to transact Ethereum, and more than that, prevent anyone who dissents. Like, I mean ok, I get t…
Yep, that is going to be an interesting thing to observe. I wonder if USA based validators will just have to block NK and Iran. What a mess.