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Tell HN: Razorpay a YC company shared donor data under a Section 91 order

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Re: Tell HN: Razorpay a YC company shared donor data under a Section 91 order

#271
post #270

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The "majority" of Indians watch and read from a small set of media outlets, most of them biased pro-government news media which feed only news showing the Indian government and authorities in a positive light while completely leaving out their problems. Basically, news confirming their biases. Critical journalism is pretty much marginal and niche - these outlets are fewer because there are very little incentives. The…

There is one thing common among Indian left-wingers and right-wingers. Both of them thinks the other wing is a frog-in-the-well.

And humans are wired to think they are better than most others: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/20954785/

Re: Tell HN: Razorpay a YC company shared donor data under a Section 91 order

#272

Earlier quoted context omitted.

India is weird. It's not really called authoritarian (rankings don't classify it as such), but there are many similar stories of government dysfunction and overreach. Maybe someone else has a word for them?

>It's not really called authoritarian (rankings don't classify it as such) Because they serve US interest, especially against China. Despite "authoritarian" being a buzzword, you should maybe base your views on a country on your observations (such as the extreme violation of basic human rights in India regarding muslims, the fact that there are laws against muslim and hindu folks marrying, labelled as "love jihad", t…

Hmm India has never been a close US’s ally, the latest example being their stand in the Russia’s invasion of Ukraine. They are more often than not at odd with the US’s interest. The only thing that brings the two sides together is China.

Re: Tell HN: Razorpay a YC company shared donor data under a Section 91 order

#273
post #269

Ok, providing a little context here about how this played out. 1. A group of Hindu women petition a court for the right to (continue) worship at (what is now) the Gyanvapi mosque 2. The court orders that a survey of the mosque be carried out to determine if there is a historical locus standii for the petition 3. Videos of the survey reveal what appears to be a Shiva linga in a pond used for ablutions 4. Heated TV deb…

A bit more context: The Gyanvapi mosque is older than the United States and the current controversy has been stirred up by Hindu nationalists targeting India's Muslim minority.

Nupur Sharma's statements created an international controversy for India with several Gulf countries demanding a public apology from India.

Zubair was arrested within days of a complaint being raised on a tweet he made in 2018, while Nupur Sharma hasn't been arrested yet, even after causing an international incident.

IMO, Razorpay would have been forced to give up the data, Section 91 or not, since the current government doesn't really care about due process.

The link below gives more details about the tweet that led to Zubair's arrest.

https://www.business-standard.com/article/current-affairs/tw...

Excerpts from the above article:

> According to the FIR, Zubair had used a screengrab of an old Hindi movie which showed an image of a hotel, with its board reading 'Hanuman hotel' instead of 'Honeymoon hotel'.

> In his tweet, Zubair had written: "BEFORE 2014: Honeymoon Hotel. After 2014: Hanuman Hotel".

> The complainant -- Twitter user @balajikijaiin, tagging the Delhi Police had written: "Linking our God Hanuman Ji with Honeymoon is a direct insult of Hindus because he is a brahmchari. Kindly take action against this."

> Noting the complaint, the police in the FIR said that the words and pictures used by Zubair in the tweet against a particular community were highly provocative and more than sufficient to incite feelings of hatred among people which can be detrimental for maintenance of public tranquility in the society.

Re: Tell HN: Razorpay a YC company shared donor data under a Section 91 order

#274

While I have no sympathy for razorpay but I'd just like to point out that laws in India are much more heavy handed than a country like US. People are thrown in jail for social media posts and sometimes just for liking a social media post(1) Twitter has been having a very hard time operating in India too(2) and routinely censoring stuff so while IANAL just remember that things are very different in different parts of…

India is weird. It's not really called authoritarian (rankings don't classify it as such), but there are many similar stories of government dysfunction and overreach. Maybe someone else has a word for them?

They are attempting to become an autocratic ethnostate

Re: Tell HN: Razorpay a YC company shared donor data under a Section 91 order

#275

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not entirely true. - TV debates in India are charged and partisan. - Nupur Sharma was debating a man named Tasneem Rehmani. - Tasleem Rehmani said something denigrating towards a Hindu God (which is normal and typically goes unpunished and even unnoticed in India). - Nupur Sharma countered him by saying "Do not mock my religion. Do you want me to start talking about flying horses or the fact that your Prophet married…

> Tasleem Rehmani said something denigrating towards a Hindu God I watched that entire debate and he didn't say anything degrading towards Hindu Gods. Here's the context- Hindu RW claimed a fountain in Gyanvapi mosque (situated in Kashi) as Shivalinga (God Shiva's phallus)[0] which is a part of larger campaign of claiming Muslims mosques as Hindu temples by RSS/BJP. Started with demolition of Babri mosque (situated i…

> Many Indians (majorly we secular Hindus) made fun of communal Hindus for claiming anything shaped like a phallus to be a "Shivalinga". I myself shared how in 1990s Hindus in San Fransisco started worshiping traffic barricade as "Shivalinga".

I will offer you a rhetorical choice. Either we agree on free speech: that you or Tasneem Rehmani or anyone else is allowed to publicly mock Hinduism by saying things like you just did: "Hindu Gods are phallic in shape" etc. and in return Hindus are allowed to mock your favorite religion or way of life in any way. Or we agree instead on no free speech: that neither anyone can mock Hindus in any way nor can Hindus mock others (as is enforced by HR departments in companies). Either way, we will make it a level playing field.

I say this choice is rhetorical because this choice does not really exist.

In reality, if Hindus are mocked, violence is rare. Hindus have no text or decree saying that if they are insulted they must engage in violence. In the rare cases there is violence, it is not due to mockery but in response to extreme acts of violence. And even so, there are groups within Hindus who will hold them to account. One oft cited example by people like you in the context of Modi are the 2002 Gujarat riots where Hindus retaliated on the streets after 59 Hindus were burned alive by a Muslim mob in a train compartment. For 20 years, every left-leaning Indian and Western publication, the usual suspects, likened him to 'fascist hitler', even though he has been exonerated at every level of court in India, including in the final appeal by the Supreme Court recently [1].

However, if Islam is mocked or even questioned, there will be threats, intimidation, violence. The Nupur Sharma case is not the first and will not be the last. As examples, see cases of Salman Rushdie [2], Ayaan Hirsi Ali [3], Geert Wilders [4], Samuel Paty [5], Charlie Hebdo [6], Mila [7], Asia Bibi [8], Salman Taseer [9], Taslima Nasrin [10] and countless more.

You are well aware of this double standard. You openly mock Hindu Gods because you are pretty certain nobody will hunt you down and kill you. You do not ever publicly mock or criticize the Islamic faith because you know you do not enjoy that same guarantee.

Winston Churchill summarized this quite well: "While the Hindu elaborates his argument, the Moslem sharpens his sword.".

I believe this double standard must change. Hindus must learn from Israel in this regard. If you hurt the Jewish people in any way, they will hurt you back. You are a 100 year old ex-Nazi in Argentina? Does not matter, the Mossad is on its way. You express an anti-Semitic opinion somewhere? You will never find meaningful work again.

> Here's the context- Hindu RW claimed a fountain in Gyanvapi mosque (situated in Kashi) as Shivalinga (God Shiva's phallus)[0] which is a part of larger campaign of claiming Muslims mosques as Hindu temples by RSS/BJP. Started with demolition of Babri mosque (situated in Ayodhya) in 1992.[1] The war-cry of the time was "Ayodhya to zaki hai. Kashi Mathura baki hai" (Ayodhya is just a trailer. Kashi and Mathura are remaining)

Simply put, you seem to be unaware of the fact that Islamic invaders destroyed places of worship wherever they went as a sign of religious conquest. In India, several waves of Islamic hordes over time destroyed tens of thousands of temples in addition to libraries and other cultural centers. The ones you list are some of the most prominent and sacred to Hindus. Islamic historians bragged about this in their own chronicles.

Upon gaining independence, any self respecting country would have restored all landmarks: city names, places of worship etc. tainted by signs of conquest to their original form. But for reasons I will not discuss here, India did not do so. Hindus must therefore fight these battles in court.

Hindus and India aside, see the cases of Hagia Sophia, converted from a church to a mosque in 1453 after the Islamic conquest of Constantinople, "the cradle of Orthodox Christian civilization"; and the Al-Aqsa mosque built at the Temple Mount in Jerusalem following Islamic conquest there. There are several other cases [11].

Samuel Huntington wrote: "Violence also occurs between Muslims, on the one hand, and Orthodox Serbs in the Balkans, Jews in Israel, Hindus in India, Buddhists in Burma and Catholics in the Philippines. Islam has bloody borders."

Just because you lack even the most basic knowledge of Indian history (due to no fault of your own; just the way it was taught or not taught to you), it does not make everything a 'Hindu RW' conspiracy.

[1] https://www.sundayguardianlive.com/news/supreme-court-reaffi...

[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Satanic_Verses_controversy

[3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ayaan_Hirsi_Ali#Al-Qaeda_hit_l...

[4] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geert_Wilders#Death_threats

[5] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_Samuel_Paty

[6] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charlie_Hebdo_shooting

[7] https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/french-teenager-in-hiding...

[8] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asia_Bibi_blasphemy_case

[9] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salman_Taseer#Assassination

[10] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taslima_Nasrin

[11] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conversion_of_non-Islamic_plac...

Re: Tell HN: Razorpay a YC company shared donor data under a Section 91 order

#276

Earlier quoted context omitted.

exactly. Only intent is to malign Razorpay, so OP also chose to create a throw away account. Razorpay didn't really have much choice in this.

The account I have used is more than a year old. I would be harassed by Hindutva goons online and offline if I use my real identity. Maybe also a false police case. Also Razorpay is not innocent here. They could have disputed the demand in the court. Could have informed the users that their data was shared with government. Could have shared only the transactions that originated in a foreign country.They did none of t…

Razorpay is innocent here. What kind of language is Hindutva Goons? Indian law is applicable at Indian soil as American law is applicable soil. American financial law are very similar for 3rd party companies. You have clear intent to hurt Razorpay brand value.

Let’s say if a CEO support country top leader and there is nothing wrong in it. He is Indian citizen and it’s his choice to do so.

I have donated several foundations in India from US via razorpay gateway and it works for few VISA cards.

You can’t dispute with police under this section given section 91 is a rare section. Your intent to harass, malign YC brand name and its companies. Please do read about section 91 and it’s implications.

Please check your claim and facts. Be a positive member to YC community. Any topic associated politics and hate should not be discussed here.

Let’s make better world talking about latest technology trends.

I think YC in future to flag post like this if they see motivation towards politics and false information.

Just updating the title doesn’t help much. The post owner pretended and presented a false and half narrative. He used only links that would be beneficial to his claim or final purpose.

Re: Tell HN: Razorpay a YC company shared donor data under a Section 91 order

#277

Quoted post unavailable.

You are linking to OpIndia - a virulent, propagandist right-wing publication?

In the context of India affairs, I trust OpIndia far more than I trust the New York Times [1].

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Indian_sentiment#New_York...

Re: Tell HN: Razorpay a YC company shared donor data under a Section 91 order

#278
post #222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> ZooBear has tweet after tweet mocking Hinduism Absolutely false. Can you share one?

There were plenty. But I think they were deleted now.

Here are some of them:

https://www.opindia.com/2022/06/netizens-dig-up-old-posts-al...

https://www.opindia.com/2022/06/alt-news-mohammed-zubair-del...

Re: Tell HN: Razorpay a YC company shared donor data under a Section 91 order

#279
post #269

Ok, providing a little context here about how this played out. 1. A group of Hindu women petition a court for the right to (continue) worship at (what is now) the Gyanvapi mosque 2. The court orders that a survey of the mosque be carried out to determine if there is a historical locus standii for the petition 3. Videos of the survey reveal what appears to be a Shiva linga in a pond used for ablutions 4. Heated TV deb…

A bit more context: The Gyanvapi mosque is older than the United States and the current controversy has been stirred up by Hindu nationalists targeting India's Muslim minority. Nupur Sharma's statements created an international controversy for India with several Gulf countries demanding a public apology from India. Zubair was arrested within days of a complaint being raised on a tweet he made in 2018, while Nupur Sha…

The original comment provides more factual context than yours:

> current controversy has been stirred up by Hindu nationalists targeting India's Muslim minority

This is just an opinion. And no mention of the ISIS-style executions carried out by the 'Muslim minority'?

> The Gyanvapi mosque is older than the United States

What is your point? The Hindu temple it was built over is older than the Islamic religion.

> Zubair was arrested within days of a complaint being raised on a tweet he made in 2018, while Nupur Sharma hasn't been arrested yet, even after causing an international incident.

Zubair was arrested for rumor mongering to disrupt harmony between religions, which is a crime in India.

And why should Nupur be arrested? She only stated facts often stated by Islamic scholars themselves.

> The link below gives more details about the tweet that led to Zubair's arrest.

Zubair has a long history of tweets and posts mocking Hindu Gods. Here are some screenshots of ones he deleted:

https://www.opindia.com/2022/06/netizens-dig-up-old-posts-al...

https://www.opindia.com/2022/06/alt-news-mohammed-zubair-del...

Re: Tell HN: Razorpay a YC company shared donor data under a Section 91 order

#280

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The account I have used is more than a year old. I would be harassed by Hindutva goons online and offline if I use my real identity. Maybe also a false police case. Also Razorpay is not innocent here. They could have disputed the demand in the court. Could have informed the users that their data was shared with government. Could have shared only the transactions that originated in a foreign country.They did none of t…

Razorpay is innocent here. What kind of language is Hindutva Goons? Indian law is applicable at Indian soil as American law is applicable soil. American financial law are very similar for 3rd party companies. You have clear intent to hurt Razorpay brand value. Let’s say if a CEO support country top leader and there is nothing wrong in it. He is Indian citizen and it’s his choice to do so. I have donated several found…

OPs fact checking gives you a good idea of the kind of “fact checking” the person in the center of this story (Zubair) used to do as well.

They hate the ruling party, who to be honest are amoral assholes like most Indian politicians and bureaucrats, so facts don’t really matter to them.

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