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FBI Child ID App

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Re: FBI Child ID App

#91

Post by [deleted] »

Silica6149 wrote: post #69
alsetmusic wrote: post #62

There's a television ad that stands out in my memory from when I was a kid (80s). The camera pans across patrons at a diner and the voiceover is about how a kidnapped child was recovered as the camera stops on a young girl (~8yo). The child is described, but the child the camera landed on has different features (hair dyed, cut, whatever). The explanation for how she was identified is that her fingerprints were on fil…

If it was a ad, was a company involved? Sending biometrics to any company should always make someone think twice.

[deleted]

Re: FBI Child ID App

#92

Post by b112 »

mminer237 wrote: post #44
eddieroger wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's no way of saying it without sounding sarcastic that yes, this feels like a scam, if not just a bad idea. The fact that they have to come out and say, "no, we're not storing pictures of your kids" doesn't help. The idea of the app is sound, and one would hope you could trust the Federal Government with such information (like they don't have it already), but the iOS6 era screenshots and verbiage feel like a rea…

It would be pretty easy to do a packet inspection and see if they're telling the truth about not transmitting the photos.

And how does one do packet inspection:

* if packets are only sent via carrier, not wifi

* if packets are sent to aws instances, which is very common

* if it all stops when phone is rooted, which is common for many apps

Re: FBI Child ID App

#93

Post by Silica6149 »

tyleo wrote: post #81
howmayiannoyyou wrote: post #67

Low grade corruption ...and here's why: The FBI is understaffed, misdirected & underfunded for its real mission, which I would argue must be fighting public corruption, organized crime and counter-espionage. Any objective analysis would conclude the Bureau has been politicized and its resources have been directed at operations, investigations and training that does not fulfill its core mission. The bad PR and mistrus…

I think you are reading a lot into the development of an app. For anything the government does it seems like folks are ready to pop out and say, “the resources would be better spent on X.” Maybe true but I’d argue doing slightly wrong things is better than listening to the orchestra of naysayers and doing nothing.

Why does the FBI have to develop an app, though? Shouldn't they focus on what they're good at and able to do, like investigating crimes?

Re: FBI Child ID App

#94

Post by kuramitropolis »

bad416f1f5a2 wrote: post #59
stonemetal12 wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

After the July 4 mass shooting a 2 year old was found wondering the scene unattended. He was safely returned to relatives. Sure I have pictures of my kids but am I alive to display them? https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-62047223

Who is going to unlock your phone to open the app when you are dead?

Face ID

Re: FBI Child ID App

#95

Post by giantg2 »

howmayiannoyyou wrote: post #67

Low grade corruption ...and here's why: The FBI is understaffed, misdirected & underfunded for its real mission, which I would argue must be fighting public corruption, organized crime and counter-espionage. Any objective analysis would conclude the Bureau has been politicized and its resources have been directed at operations, investigations and training that does not fulfill its core mission. The bad PR and mistrus…

What you're describing isn't necessarily corruption. It sounds more like incompetence paired with worrying more about appearances than actual results.

Re: FBI Child ID App

#96

Post by b112 »

namelessoracle wrote: post #77
Silica6149 wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting... the FBI could ask or already have a backdoor provided by Apple.

It makes me wonder if downloading this app gives the FBI a ready made backdoor into your iPhone. (not sure if that's even possible with the iOS infrastructure)

Apple scans apps, code, as does Google.

But what if an Apple employee works for the FBI? Large firms are known to have moles in them, both from competitors, and from government.

Re: FBI Child ID App

#97

Post by Dracophoenix »

howmayiannoyyou wrote: post #67

Low grade corruption ...and here's why: The FBI is understaffed, misdirected & underfunded for its real mission, which I would argue must be fighting public corruption, organized crime and counter-espionage. Any objective analysis would conclude the Bureau has been politicized and its resources have been directed at operations, investigations and training that does not fulfill its core mission. The bad PR and mistrus…

The FBI has seized assets through civil forfeiture for decades.

https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2021-06-09/fbi-beve...

That's not "low grade" corruption. It's the plainest form of corruption conducted en masse and in a highly organized fashion. When an arm of the government can take your property without due process, any suspicion towards them is warranted.

With regards to this new app, I wouldn't be surprised if this becomes a way to tap into every phone in the country.

Re: FBI Child ID App

#98

Post by [deleted] »

alsetmusic wrote: post #62

There's a television ad that stands out in my memory from when I was a kid (80s). The camera pans across patrons at a diner and the voiceover is about how a kidnapped child was recovered as the camera stops on a young girl (~8yo). The child is described, but the child the camera landed on has different features (hair dyed, cut, whatever). The explanation for how she was identified is that her fingerprints were on fil…

[deleted]

Re: FBI Child ID App

#99

Post by shadowgovt »

trey-jones wrote: post #89
alsetmusic wrote: post #62

There's a television ad that stands out in my memory from when I was a kid (80s). The camera pans across patrons at a diner and the voiceover is about how a kidnapped child was recovered as the camera stops on a young girl (~8yo). The child is described, but the child the camera landed on has different features (hair dyed, cut, whatever). The explanation for how she was identified is that her fingerprints were on fil…

This was a very big thing in the late 80s apparently. Our local Kiwanis Club had provided IDs for parents in the community who wanted them. They just had a photo of the child with some other physical descriptions like eye color and birthmarks. Still, kind of a local, analog version of this, but without the dystopian bent. I agree, this feels more creepy than useful/helpful service.

There was a moral panic about kidnapped children in the '80s that resulted in parents getting their kids fingerprinted. The macabre side of it is that it wasn't for reuniting living kids... Very many children who can talk (i.e. 8 years old) would be able to describe their parents to the cops well enough to track them down from phone book data. It was really useful data for identifying John and Jane Doe corpses though.

Re: FBI Child ID App

#100

Post by rbanffy »

GavinMcG wrote: post #83
rbanffy wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> No child's fingerprints are getting checked unless some foul play is already suspected. A simple way around it is to have the kid fingerprinted and only release the information if the kid needs to be tracked/located.

I think the comment is pointing out that if your child is kidnapped and raised elsewhere, there will not be a reason to fingerprint them then for comparison unless there's already a reason to think they may have been kidnapped. That is, it might help on the back end, but the comment is suggesting that mass fingerprinting is not likely to move the needle much.

A small chance is better than no chance. I was answering to the privacy concern, not the effectiveness of the method. It seems like a plausible business model to professionally collect hold biometric data encrypted with the owner's keys, opaque to the party storing the data.

It's a bit like the businesses that store umbilical cord stem cells for the very unlikely chance they'll be useful at some point in the future.

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