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I don't care how you web dev; I just need more better web apps

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Re: I don't care how you web dev; I just need more better web apps

#91

Post by ls15 »

pketh wrote: post #64
anamexis wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry, I think I misspoke, I meant the hover/unhover when mousing over cards, and in particular unhover.

Ah ic, are they jittery in the sense that they’re skipping/dropping frames or moving unexpectedly fast?

I think they need to be more smooth in order to look natural, so I would try with some basic easeInOut or easeOut instead of the jumpy movement and then go from there. In my opinion interaction animations should be really fast, otherwise they slow down some users.

I also wonder if there is a timing issue with invoking the animations. Some of them get invoked immediately on hover and some of them seem to be delayed.

Re: I don't care how you web dev; I just need more better web apps

#92

Post by ketzo »

croes wrote: post #54
omarhaneef wrote: post #28

The author complains that developers argue about their tools and methods, insist on their favorite techniques, but produce (more) worse apps. Particularly for the amount of time and effort expended on developing the apps. The thing is: the debates aren’t naive. They’re exactly trying to workout the details. When someone says, hey forget postgresql and just use SQLite, and someone else says good luck if you hit n rows…

I disagree. Web devs aren't discussing characters and plots but instead argue which typewriter to use. Better tools don't make better apps just like word processors don't make better books. The best web dev tools are worthless if the UX is bad.

This is assuming that software quality is purely a function of the software engineer’s mind and creative ability, almost like art or writing.

Many - most? - software devs know multiple ways they could make their apps higher quality, but they just don’t have the time or ability right now, or they have other priorities, or so on.

Better tools can, and do, enable engineers to simply do more than they otherwise could, and sometimes “more” actually does mean “better.”

Re: I don't care how you web dev; I just need more better web apps

#93

Post by onion2k »

omarhaneef wrote: post #28

The author complains that developers argue about their tools and methods, insist on their favorite techniques, but produce (more) worse apps. Particularly for the amount of time and effort expended on developing the apps. The thing is: the debates aren’t naive. They’re exactly trying to workout the details. When someone says, hey forget postgresql and just use SQLite, and someone else says good luck if you hit n rows…

When someone says, hey forget postgresql and just use SQLite, and someone else says good luck if you hit n rows, and someone says it can easily handle n+m rows with x memory …

This is a good example of how devs get things wrong. The argument between which database to use because you might hit the row limit has zero benefit to the user. It's devs wanting to avoid future work to migrate from one database to another; a problem most apps will never actually see.

There's even an aphorism about this exact thing in dev: YAGNI https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/You_aren%27t_gonna_need_it

Solve the problem you have, not thr problem you want.

Re: I don't care how you web dev; I just need more better web apps

#94

Post by eastbound »

patrick451 wrote: post #32
aranchelk wrote: post #29

> Everybody seems to have an opinion on how you do your web dev and how websites and web apps should be structured. It’s true and it leads to many annoying unproductive arguments, IMO the reason is a fundamental lack of a scientific mindset in evaluating techniques and tooling. We don’t have theories or testable hypotheses, we have opinions. On one level I like and agree with the author’s idea that results are what r…

It's shocking to me how little data there seems to be to support what many consider to be "best practice". About the only real data point I see thrown around is that bugs per LOC being fairly constant. Thus, you get people saying long, two-page functions are bad and should be broken up. But never have I seen someone backup such an exhortation with data. Let alone more nebulous rules like "objects should be open for e…

In the olden times there were scientists actually researching project management, measuring, changing inputs, performing experiments, probably at IBM or NASA.

We don’t do this anymore, because IT is now less costly, and sometimes doing the thing is faster than writing the plan for it. So Agile won. Probably deterministic methodologies got stuck in a local minimum, which was ridiculously expensive to run compared to Agile. I still have my book of IBM RUP process.

Re: I don't care how you web dev; I just need more better web apps

#95

Post by croes »

xwdv wrote: post #72
croes wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree. Web devs aren't discussing characters and plots but instead argue which typewriter to use. Better tools don't make better apps just like word processors don't make better books. The best web dev tools are worthless if the UX is bad.

Frameworks are not tools. You select technologies based on their fit for the requirements of the web app.

Frameworks are tools

Re: I don't care how you web dev; I just need more better web apps

#97

Post by croes »

gfody wrote: post #89
croes wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So just because you can remove screws more easily you build better shelves? You can build bad apps with good tools and good apps with bad tools. Just because it gets easier for the web dev doesn't makes it easier for the user and vice versa.

you're making a point here and the counterpoint is that building good apps with bad tools requires extra effort that costs money that the business owners don't have because the market won't support it (ie nobody is willing to pay more for higher quality stuff - you need to figure out how to make high quality easier)

But the whole point of the article is that the apps are bad no matter the tools. One should first know how to produce high quality in the first place before thinking about how to produce it more easily. All the brushes in the world won't let me paint like Leonardo da Vinci.

Re: I don't care how you web dev; I just need more better web apps

#98

Post by gfody »

croes wrote: post #97
gfody wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

you're making a point here and the counterpoint is that building good apps with bad tools requires extra effort that costs money that the business owners don't have because the market won't support it (ie nobody is willing to pay more for higher quality stuff - you need to figure out how to make high quality easier)

But the whole point of the article is that the apps are bad no matter the tools. One should first know how to produce high quality in the first place before thinking about how to produce it more easily. All the brushes in the world won't let me paint like Leonardo da Vinci.

I don't disagree but quality tools are about raising the floor, I haven't had to worry about a ceiling falling on me my whole life because fastener technology is very good

Re: I don't care how you web dev; I just need more better web apps

#99

Post by aaaaaaaaaaab »

pketh wrote: post #13

relevant but also self-promo: I build https://kinopio.club a spatial thinking tool that's also (I hope) a good website. I'm only one person without the resources to build separate ios/android apps so the website needs to work everywhere and be fast and responsive

The banner at the top is constantly appearing/disappearing. It’s super annoying, and this is just one of the issues…

Sorry, but in its current state your website is a good example of why webapps are inferior to native ones.

Re: I don't care how you web dev; I just need more better web apps

#100

Post by syradar »

accrual wrote: post #8
grzm wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Parse error: blind to rank in conversations Meaning ignoring class/hierarchy when speaking with others

I occasionally work with a guy who opens every email with "Hey " regardless of who it is and it always struck me as informal. I wonder if it's a similar rank-blindness in conversations.

Swede here, it’s really prevalent in Sweden to just use first names irrespective of who it is. Your boss, boss’s boss, your doctor, or as the case of an athlete winning an Olympic medal: even the prime minister, even calling her a nickname[1].

I believe it is partly due to a reform back in the days dropping thou and titles[2].

1. https://www.aftonbladet.se/sportbladet/a/Bj4Lkg/os-2022-nils... (Swedish)

2. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Du-reformen

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