I sometimes wonder if I'm the only one who just wants a bank to be a bank. I've been with the same relatively small regional bank for 30 years. I have a checking account, savings account and that's it. They've been stable this entire time, and I've never worried my money was going to disappear. As another sign of being an old man, I'm old enough to remember the phrase "as safe as money in the bank". You see, when I w…
I invite you to look at the list of failed banks provided by the FDIC: https://www.fdic.gov/resources/resolutions/bank-failures/fai... Notice that the vast majority of these are smaller, local or regional banks.
Voyager suspends trading, deposits, withdrawals, and loyalty rewards
181–190 of 245 posts
Re: Voyager suspends trading, deposits, withdrawals, and loyalty rewards
#182There's a myth that Voyager is FDIC insured. It's pure marketing. Voyager has an omnibus account with the Metropolitan Commercial Bank where Voyager's customers deposit their money. Voyager acts as the money manager of the omnibus account and has absolute control over the money. Metropolitan is a member of FDIC and is FDIC insured. In the case of the Metropolitan bank failing, the FDIC insurance kicks in to cover any…
https://invest-voyager.medium.com/usd-held-with-voyager-is-n...
Re: Voyager suspends trading, deposits, withdrawals, and loyalty rewards
#183Earlier quoted context omitted.
The Fed runs stress tests all the time and currently the banks are preforming perfectly during them.
which means the tests are not stressing. That is a good thing as they test for conditions that previously resulted in crashes. But it could also be a bad thing if the banks adapted to formally pass tests while straining their business with schemes that are overlooked
Basically stress tests simulate large drops in asset values, but during COVID the trading desks made bucketloads of money when volatility was high. The financial sector is pretty resilient these days, the risky stuff mostly moved off bank balance sheets into private funds not subject to the same regulatory requirements.
Re: Voyager suspends trading, deposits, withdrawals, and loyalty rewards
#184Another one? Tether is looking stressed. In the last three months, a lot of Tether has been cashed out. Look at the chart for Market Cap -> Last 3 months.[1] From US$82 billion to US$66 billion. Today, US$200 million was cashed out. Every few days, their market cap drops suddenly. At this rate, in a few months we'll find out how much backing Tether really has, because it is being paid out. Stablecoins have two stable…
Tether's market cap dropping without a price drop is indication that they are liquid and able to handle (to date) almost $20 billion in withdrawal over a 1 month period. That is impressive and a sign of their robustness. They are passing a stress test so far. Their blog counters much of the FUD out there: https://tether.to/en/news/
Re: Voyager suspends trading, deposits, withdrawals, and loyalty rewards
#185Earlier quoted context omitted.
> makes customers whole *As long as whole is less than $250k.
Yes, that's the worst case - however in the real world the FDIC and the OTS (Office of Thrift Supervision) does their best to ensure nobody loses any amount of money regardless of their account balance. In the case of WaMu in 2008 for instance, the OTS took possession of the bank and sold it to JPMorgan Chase. They didn't draw on the deposit insurance fund and everyone stayed whole. [1] "According to FDIC spokeswoman…
Back in the 2007-2010 financial crisis, IndyMac Bank went under. They were a major bank on the west coast, especially the Los Angeles metro area.
And when they did, there were thousands of depositors who were over the FDIC limits for their accounts, which at the time were only $100,000 per account, not yet raised to $250,000 per account. Some were individuals, some were businesses, some were trust accounts, some were only supposed to be temporarily over the limit because they held money from a deceased person that was a life insurance payout or going through probate, and so on.
But what was really unusual in their case was that the FDIC could not find any other bank that would take over IndyMac Bank directly, and assume its debts and deposits.
So the FDIC had to create a brand new bank out of whole cloth, called IndyMac Federal Bank (note the name), to take over IndyMac Bank, before it could be dealt with further. Eventually it got acquired by One West.
Just this one bank's failure cost the FDIC eleven billion dollars. And the FDIC as an agency barely managed to stay afloat during the 2007-2010 financial crisis, because it had so many banks where it had to either manage shotgun weddings with other more-stable banks, or bail them out entirely. Of course, the FDIC had an implicit backstop from Congress, but they came damn near bumping up against their full budget during this time period.
And again, that eleven billion for that one bank was not counting all the people who were over their deposit limits -- $270 million over the limits, in total. Those people were screwed.
https://www.latimes.com/archives/blogs/money-company/story/2...
Re: Voyager suspends trading, deposits, withdrawals, and loyalty rewards
#186> We are in discussions with various parties regarding additional liquidity and the go-forward strategy for the company. While we don’t have anything else to share today, we are working diligently and hope to have more information to share soon. Translation: we are insolvent. The action we have taken prevents a run that will wipe out our working capital. We have been running a fractional reserve all along. This is ge…
> We have been running a fractional reserve all along How do you know that? It’s possible 3 Arrows missed their loan payments and that was enough to prevent them from meeting liquidity demands, no?
The very first line on https://www.investvoyager.com:
>Build your wealth. Earn up to 12% annual rewards. Beat your bank by earning top rewards each month on 39 digital assets with no lockups.
Doing 12% APY when the fed funds rate was 0.5% meant they were loaning those deposits out at more than 13%. That's a pretty bad rate for a commercial loan. The only companies taking out those loans are doing so because they were rejected from regular banks. Why? Well now we know: it was all crypto hedge funds who were levered up and instantly imploded the minute crypto started to go down.
Re: Voyager suspends trading, deposits, withdrawals, and loyalty rewards
#187> We are in discussions with various parties regarding additional liquidity and the go-forward strategy for the company. While we don’t have anything else to share today, we are working diligently and hope to have more information to share soon. Translation: we are insolvent. The action we have taken prevents a run that will wipe out our working capital. We have been running a fractional reserve all along. This is ge…
Celsius made a similar statement nearly 3 weeks ago and there hasn't been any movement since then.
Re: Voyager suspends trading, deposits, withdrawals, and loyalty rewards
#188Earlier quoted context omitted.
Tether's market cap dropping without a price drop is indication that they are liquid and able to handle (to date) almost $20 billion in withdrawal over a 1 month period. That is impressive and a sign of their robustness. They are passing a stress test so far. Their blog counters much of the FUD out there: https://tether.to/en/news/
It seems like it would be pretty binary. That is, withdrawals would be orderly... until they are suddenly not . It's not very good evidence for the state of their backing now . Maybe they've chewed through all their liquid assets and will explode tomorrow, maybe not. That is, withdrawals wouldn't shake the Tether price at all until someone is told "no you can't withdraw today" and decides to sell their Tethers on the…
Re: Voyager suspends trading, deposits, withdrawals, and loyalty rewards
#189How can a bank get off the ground without using fractional reserves or relying on the founders putting their own money at risk to start the business? No giving out loans until you've created enough of a buffer? But how to build that buffer in the first place, high fees? But how to successfully enter a competitive market as an unknown newcomer charging high fees?
Re: Voyager suspends trading, deposits, withdrawals, and loyalty rewards
#190There's a myth that Voyager is FDIC insured. It's pure marketing. Voyager has an omnibus account with the Metropolitan Commercial Bank where Voyager's customers deposit their money. Voyager acts as the money manager of the omnibus account and has absolute control over the money. Metropolitan is a member of FDIC and is FDIC insured. In the case of the Metropolitan bank failing, the FDIC insurance kicks in to cover any…
> This is also a good time to remind everyone that USD is held by our banking partner, Metropolitan Commercial Bank, which is FDIC insured. The cash you hold with Voyager is protected up to $250,000–which means it’s as safe with us as at a bank.
They also said:
> Through our strategic relationships with our banking partners, all customers’ USD held with Voyager is now FDIC insured. That means that in the rare event your USD funds are compromised due to the company or our banking partner’s failure, you are guaranteed a full reimbursement (up to $250,000).
The "That means that in the rare event your USD funds are compromised due to the company" is what is confusing people.