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YouTube removes criticism of dangerous fractal wood burning, but leaves up tips

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Re: YouTube removes criticism of dangerous fractal wood burning, but leaves up tips

#221

Post by throw10920 »

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #48
CM30 wrote: post #32

YouTube's moderation is ridiculous, and it demonstrates the problem Google has in general. They don't like paying actual people to moderate their sites, and rely on automated systems and bots to do everything for them. So, if there's ever an issue (or you have a bunch of scammers mass reporting you because you debunk their 'work'), then YouTube/Google seems to think you're the problem instead of the scumbags. We need…

> We need things to change here. We need Google to moderate their services properly, Human moderation isn’t perfectly consistent, either. It would be extraordinarily expensive to expect YouTube to have humans moderate everything manually. What are people willing to give up in exchange for a human-moderated version of YouTube? Would we be okay if they charged a $3 “moderation fee” on every upload to cover the cost of…

> Would we be okay if they charged a $3 “moderation fee” on every upload to cover the cost of paying someone to watch the video and evaluate how it fits YouTube’s rules? The big creators wouldn’t care, but the small time videos would immediately stop being uploaded and competitor websites would become popular overnight.

That would actually be pretty ideal - most consumers watch YouTube for the bigger channels and popular content anyway, so they would stay on the platform, which would validate that revenue model. The smaller producers and consumers would both leave, which would help build competitors to YouTube. The big producers who remain will be slightly disincentivized to spam low-quality videos (including those text-to-speech automated ones that some people here have found). And, Google will have no excuse for not using humans to moderate videos anymore (can't cite "cost concerns" when you're literally pricing it in).

Seems like a win-win-win to me.

Re: YouTube removes criticism of dangerous fractal wood burning, but leaves up tips

#222

Post by DoughnutHole »

mrtksn wrote: post #60

We really need to finish with this content removal business and simply hold people accountable for the content. In other words, YouTube or any "utility level" platform should not have the right to remove content by its own and just request information to protect itself. For example, if someone is posting about something harmful the videos should remain and the person who does that should face the consequences. It's n…

YouTube didn't introduce content moderation (apart from copyright, and flat out illegal material) because daddy government told them to.

They introduced moderation because companies threatened to pull advertising because they didn't want their brands plastered next to awful content.

YouTube totally has the right to leave plenty of dangerous or morally repugnant content up. But they don't have the right to other companies' advertising money if said companies jump ship.

Re: YouTube removes criticism of dangerous fractal wood burning, but leaves up tips

#223

Post by foobarian »

colejohnson66 wrote: post #24
dazzawazza wrote: post #3

Big Clive has a good video on why this is dangerous and how to make it more safe. Note: not safe safe, just more safe. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FBeSKL9zVro

I like Big Clive (and Electroboom) because they know how to be safe, but do the stupid thing anyways (safely) to show how bad the ideas are.

It's disappointing how most of the articles and videos criticizing the dangerous content don't explain why exactly something is dangerous. They just scream "omg high voltage" "one mistake you're dead" and so on. I honestly think they are worse than the source; it reminds me of the medieval experimenters and alchemists being oppressed by the conformist public.

Re: YouTube removes criticism of dangerous fractal wood burning, but leaves up tips

#224

Post by wmeredith »

whiddershins wrote: post #184

34 people killed is a pretty surprising number. Is it fair to refer to the makers of the videos as murderers? On a moral, if not legal, level?

I'm not sure murder is the right crime here. Seems more passive like willfull neglect or something. Not a lawyer.

Re: YouTube removes criticism of dangerous fractal wood burning, but leaves up tips

#225

Post by framapotari »

mrtksn wrote: post #206
DangitBobby wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the video goes down and fewer people see it, fewer people die. How was the censorship pointless? You didn't "solve" any problems, you just ignored the actual complexity of the real world to uphold your ideals.

Speech is not magic spell. Sure, in Turkey the government believes that Netflix makes people gay and they regulate Netflix to ungay the Turkish youth but this is just as ridiculous as the censorship on other topics on other parts of the world. If someone is dying because of a video, the fix is not in removal of the video. Sure, you can put labels agains poor judgement like they do on physical products.

> If someone is dying because of a video, the fix is not in removal of the video

It might not be 'the' fix but it could be 'a' fix. If your interest is preventing deaths that is.

Re: YouTube removes criticism of dangerous fractal wood burning, but leaves up tips

#226

Post by subjectsigma »

pjc50 wrote: post #120
usrn wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't you have empathy for poor creators like the executive branch of the US federal government though? The dislike button was making things rough for them.

What?

Videos of Biden (speeches, etc) were regularly seeing abysmal like/dislike ratios, esp on official news channels like CNN. Then suddenly YouTube removed dislikes because of "dislike bombs". There was some speculation they were specifically pressured by someone (Biden or the media) to remove dislikes so their ratings would stop being negatively affected.

This is really silly because the theory assumes that A) Biden cares or even knows about people disliking YouTube videos of him and B) that CNN doesn't already receive preferential treatment from YouTube and couldn't just ask for an algorithmic boost regardless of how many likes/dislikes they have

Most likely it was because YouTube's own content (such as Rewind) was getting dislike bombed.

Re: YouTube removes criticism of dangerous fractal wood burning, but leaves up tips

#227

Post by mikestew »

ChrisMarshallNY wrote: post #148
fendy3002 wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Such as a gun is always loaded, my take is electricity is always dangerous. Even professionals can get into accidents, moreover us uneducated plebs.

I remember watching some electricians rewiring some stuff at my old workplace. We were moving into a new office, and had to have some light switches changed for the new zone. The electrician popped open the switch plates, yanked out the old switches, clipped the wires, stripped the wires, wired up the new switches, and screwed everything back together. It was all live (like 300 volt live), as the lights turned on (qu…

It obviously can be done, and I've heard folks more experienced than I say "all ya gotta do...", and I'll admit that I might have even wired a switch/outlet myself without flipping the breaker. And a pro could probably get away with it for a long time.

But it just sounds like something that is one distraction away from a bad day.

Re: YouTube removes criticism of dangerous fractal wood burning, but leaves up tips

#228

Post by account42 »

washadjeffmad wrote: post #162
blntechie wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Horizontal sandwich toasters are the popular kind of toasters around my parts. It can make from plain toasts to fully stuffed sandwiches and are not that hard to clean either. I guess Americans will consider them more as a grill though.

Panini presses are less common here only* because they take up more kitchen real estate than a smaller upright appliance and can be reasonably replaced by a skillet. "George Foreman grills" were in vogue for a few years in the 2000s, but I rarely ever see them now. *Probably also because American bread is awful.

> Probably also because American bread is awful.

Except grilling it is the best thing you can do to oversugared white bread.

Re: YouTube removes criticism of dangerous fractal wood burning, but leaves up tips

#229

Post by napolux »

pornel wrote: post #10

There is a massive YouTube and Instagram industry of outright faking craft and cooking tips. They're not just bad or a stretch, they're intentionally fabricated, made at scale by TheSoul Publishing with 550 employees. That's because making cool things looking surprisingly easy goes viral way better than actual reality-grounded instructions, and for the adtech giants nothing matters except the number of clicks. Before…

5 minutes crafts should be illegal

Re: YouTube removes criticism of dangerous fractal wood burning, but leaves up tips

#230

Post by CM30 »

denton-scratch wrote: post #131
CM30 wrote: post #32

YouTube's moderation is ridiculous, and it demonstrates the problem Google has in general. They don't like paying actual people to moderate their sites, and rely on automated systems and bots to do everything for them. So, if there's ever an issue (or you have a bunch of scammers mass reporting you because you debunk their 'work'), then YouTube/Google seems to think you're the problem instead of the scumbags. We need…

> we need these scammers to get arrested/sued/whatever for misleading info Don't you think that it's the broadcaster that should be penalised? It is Goo/YT that is promulgating the misinfo. The scammers/creators would go away, if Goo/YT moderated as if their income depended on it.

Eh, both are to blame here. The platforms/broadcasters for hosting this content and not removing it when it's proven to be dangerous/illegal/whatever, and the creators for making such content and putting people's lives at risk. It's like the situation with fake products on Amazon; yes Amazon shares some of the blame for not policing their marketplace, but we can't let the scammers/counterfeiters off the hook either, since they're deliberately trying to scam people.

Plus these folks likely wouldn't go away, they'd just go to other places to distribute their 'wares'.

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