Next.js also has no js only server side rendered support in alpha
https://nextjs.org/docs/advanced-features/react-18/server-co...
Fresh is a new full stack web framework for Deno
231–240 of 249 posts
Re: Fresh is a new full stack web framework for Deno
#232Maybe I am getting all wrong, but this sounds like PHP.
I'm excited for server-side rendering to return to the mainstream so that in a few years I can revolutionize the industry with my ingenious new idea to render things on the client with Javascript!
You might even land the ultimate innovation of doing both by "inventing" AJAX! (Just call it something new, like piped hydration)
Re: Fresh is a new full stack web framework for Deno
#233`deno run -A` So we're giving up on "it's more secure"? EDIT: I'm actually a real fan of Deno, but that was never because of its security promises. Security is both technical and cultural, and I think cases like this suggest that while the technical side was always shaky, the cultural side is just as weak. If first-party material promotes the idea of running scripts with `-A`, then that's the direction the community…
Security makes more sense for deno when your host your app in serverless v8 hosting environments like deno. They don't even have a way to specify all permissions. v8 isolates are the new cool thing in serverless hosting especially with wasm providing way to run c/rust code on v8. We have to see how this will pan out compared to containers.
Isn't the hosting environment providing the security in that case? I can run Nodejs code on AWS Lambda, and CloudFlare also has their own edge runtime environment which is based on v8 isolates but isn't Deno.
Re: Fresh is a new full stack web framework for Deno
#234Earlier quoted context omitted.
Security makes more sense for deno when your host your app in serverless v8 hosting environments like deno. They don't even have a way to specify all permissions. v8 isolates are the new cool thing in serverless hosting especially with wasm providing way to run c/rust code on v8. We have to see how this will pan out compared to containers.
Isn't the hosting environment providing the security in that case? I can run Nodejs code on AWS Lambda, and CloudFlare also has their own edge runtime environment which is based on v8 isolates but isn't Deno.
What I meant was that you could emulate locked down version that deno or cloudflare provide in your local during development with the granularity of permissions. I though lambda was a full container running app, did they add isolate environment to it?
Re: Fresh is a new full stack web framework for Deno
#235Earlier quoted context omitted.
Isn't the hosting environment providing the security in that case? I can run Nodejs code on AWS Lambda, and CloudFlare also has their own edge runtime environment which is based on v8 isolates but isn't Deno.
What I meant was that you could emulate locked down version that deno or cloudflare provide in your local during development with the granularity of permissions. I though lambda was a full container running app, did they add isolate environment to it?
Oh I see what you're saying. Yes, while I'm not an expert I suppose Lambdas are less isolated than CF workers or Deno Deploy, while being pragmatically more isolated than e.g. a regular VM.
Re: Fresh is a new full stack web framework for Deno
#236Are there any examples of things made with Fresh available?
I was pleasantly surprised to find that they finally dogfood Fresh for https://deno.land/
Source can be found here https://github.com/denoland/dotland
Re: Fresh is a new full stack web framework for Deno
#237In 2007 I was writing websites that were mostly rendered on a server, with JavaScript used selectively in some places for interactivity I remember writing at the time that moving everything to the client was solving one problem (poor encapsulation of JavaScript-powered front-end components) with another (needlessly rendering everything on the client) The industry moved toward CSR anyway, and I had to learn it to cont…
Indeed, I love how the front-end world is following the wheel back to server-side. It's like how all the cool kids are dressing like it's the 1980s/90s.
Re: Fresh is a new full stack web framework for Deno
#238anyone could convince me why we should use this instead using battle tested framework like ruby on rails or phoenix?
Re: Fresh is a new full stack web framework for Deno
#239Maybe I am getting all wrong, but this sounds like PHP.
To me the part about: "... and the client is only responsible for re-rendering small islands of interactivity. A model where the developer explicitly opts in to client side rendering for specific components. ..." actually sounds more like ASP.NET (the original Web Forms, not Core) support for AJAX: https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/dotnet/api/system.web.ui.up...
I had the same thought. I read the islands overview and was had a little "what's old is new again" chuckle.
Re: Fresh is a new full stack web framework for Deno
#240In 2007 I was writing websites that were mostly rendered on a server, with JavaScript used selectively in some places for interactivity I remember writing at the time that moving everything to the client was solving one problem (poor encapsulation of JavaScript-powered front-end components) with another (needlessly rendering everything on the client) The industry moved toward CSR anyway, and I had to learn it to cont…
As posted in a similar HN thread: thesis, antithesis, synthesis.
An idea comes up. It solves problems, but it also has shortcomings. An antithesis that deals fixed the shortcomings comes up and is adopted. Turns out it also has shortcomings of its own. The synthesis merged them together.
And repeat.
(these are the ideas from some thinker whose name I forget)