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The Modos Paper Monitor

modos.tech

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Re: The Modos Paper Monitor

#21

Post by londons_explore »

pooper wrote: post #20
londons_explore wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Alas, I would love to implement this, but the world of eink is filled with patents and lawsuits, and I think that if I implemented this and it worked well I could never sell it. Even if I gave it away for free, I'd probably have lawyers banging on my door wanting to take away my home.

Please excuse my ignorance but are there new patents coming in every year or is it more like mp3 where we had a patent but eventually it expired? My question is like will we have e ink in about twenty years?

While any company is trying to do R&D and sell product, there tends to be new patents each year. That means there never a nice 20 year boundary when it becomes safe to build on top of the tech, because you'll always have the threat of a lawsuit that you are violating one of the newer patents in your implementation. And the costs of such litigation deters investors, even if you would have a good chance of winning.

Re: The Modos Paper Monitor

#22

Post by bayindirh »

pooper wrote: post #20
londons_explore wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Alas, I would love to implement this, but the world of eink is filled with patents and lawsuits, and I think that if I implemented this and it worked well I could never sell it. Even if I gave it away for free, I'd probably have lawyers banging on my door wanting to take away my home.

Please excuse my ignorance but are there new patents coming in every year or is it more like mp3 where we had a patent but eventually it expired? My question is like will we have e ink in about twenty years?

The methods or refreshing e-ink displays are called "Wave Functions" in e-ink parlance, and they're actually implemented in software.

However, somehow they're so closely guarded, and even if you have top of the line e-ink reader, it might not come with a license for a nice Wave Function which refreshes your display very nicely. For example, one of the most attractive features of Kindles is they use the best Wave Functions available for their displays (they may even licensed it exclusively) which refreshes the screens instantly and smoothly. My Kobo, while using the same screen, has more clunky refreshing modes built in.

Moreover, it seems, not all methods are provided on every CPU architecture, and you can't see the code of these things.

Lastly, these methods are probably improved upon and re-patented to keep the barrier for entry pretty high. New screens are definitely developed with more features, and they need new Wave Functions to work as expected.

Re: The Modos Paper Monitor

#23

Post by fho »

I am still hoping for a large, reasonable priced eInk display that I can frame and hang up on a wall. Does not even have to be color, I would be fine with just changing through different black&white dithered images over time. But large eInk displays are prohibitively expensive for what is basically a gimmick :-/

Re: The Modos Paper Monitor

#24

Post by Jedd »

bowsamic wrote: post #18
AlbertoGP wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They do have concept design renders in a follow-up blog post, “Designing the Modos Paper Monitor”: https://www.modos.tech/blog/designing-modos-paper-monitor

I know, they must put it right at the top of the landing page

Would you buy one if the picture was at the top of the page?

If not, then they don't need to.

Re: The Modos Paper Monitor

#25

Post by bowsamic »

Jedd wrote: post #24
bowsamic wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know, they must put it right at the top of the landing page

Would you buy one if the picture was at the top of the page? If not, then they don't need to.

I would be much more likely to not immediately close the tab, yes.

Re: The Modos Paper Monitor

#26

Post by dsr_ »

meon46 wrote: post #3

I know a lot a people seem to prefer e-paper to LCDs. However, I have not yet found papers that could show a significant benefit with regards to eye strain of e-paper over other types of displays. If you are outside and have reflections, shure - but inside?

Here's my anecdata:

Reading fiction on a 300+dpi OLED set to white on black is absolutely wonderful for me, and I can do it for several hours in a row, provided that the ambient illumination is not full sunlight.

Reading fiction on a 180ish dpi E-ink screen is fine but a little aggravating because changing to the next page takes so long. Not-very-black on light grey is not my favorite color scheme.

Re: The Modos Paper Monitor

#27

Post by nextos »

fho wrote: post #23

I am still hoping for a large, reasonable priced eInk display that I can frame and hang up on a wall. Does not even have to be color, I would be fine with just changing through different black&white dithered images over time. But large eInk displays are prohibitively expensive for what is basically a gimmick :-/

Me too, but perhaps cheap AMOLEDs will come sooner and they can kind of be an okeyish replacement? If one runs an AMOLED on black background, e.g. a terminal, a text editor or an inverted PDF, only the pixels displaying characters will be lit.

Maybe this is good enough? I experimented with an AMOLED tablet displaying inverted PDFs and it felt similar to a Kindle. However, this was my completely subjective perception. It could be that in the long run, it is tiring for the eyes as well. IMHO, the worst part about displays is staring at a bright LED backlight all day long. Screens such as Dell UltraSharp, which are able to dim the backlight a lot and do not flicker feel much better.

Re: The Modos Paper Monitor

#28

Post by bayindirh »

nextos wrote: post #27
fho wrote: post #23

I am still hoping for a large, reasonable priced eInk display that I can frame and hang up on a wall. Does not even have to be color, I would be fine with just changing through different black&white dithered images over time. But large eInk displays are prohibitively expensive for what is basically a gimmick :-/

Me too, but perhaps cheap AMOLEDs will come sooner and they can kind of be an okeyish replacement? If one runs an AMOLED on black background, e.g. a terminal, a text editor or an inverted PDF, only the pixels displaying characters will be lit. Maybe this is good enough? I experimented with an AMOLED tablet displaying inverted PDFs and it felt similar to a Kindle. However, this was my completely subjective perception.…

OLED displays cannot replace E-ink displays. Even reading on dark backgrounds with OLED tires my eyes the same way using an IPS panel.

Nothing can replace the dynamics of an e-ink display as of today.

Re: The Modos Paper Monitor

#29

Post by bayindirh »

dsr_ wrote: post #26
meon46 wrote: post #3

I know a lot a people seem to prefer e-paper to LCDs. However, I have not yet found papers that could show a significant benefit with regards to eye strain of e-paper over other types of displays. If you are outside and have reflections, shure - but inside?

Here's my anecdata: Reading fiction on a 300+dpi OLED set to white on black is absolutely wonderful for me, and I can do it for several hours in a row, provided that the ambient illumination is not full sunlight. Reading fiction on a 180ish dpi E-ink screen is fine but a little aggravating because changing to the next page takes so long. Not-very-black on light grey is not my favorite color scheme.

Try a relatively modern 300 dpi screen like a paperwhite or Kobo Glo HD, and you'll be really amazed how comfortable reading becomes.

Re: The Modos Paper Monitor

#30

Post by reacharavindh »

fho wrote: post #23

I am still hoping for a large, reasonable priced eInk display that I can frame and hang up on a wall. Does not even have to be color, I would be fine with just changing through different black&white dithered images over time. But large eInk displays are prohibitively expensive for what is basically a gimmick :-/

This. I'd buy a reasonably priced 10+ inch E-ink display that I can use as an art display on the wall or a creative dashboard of things I care about. However, anything above the size of a Kindle is too expensive for this purpose. A kindle is rather too small...

I will wait until I can buy one for I dont need wifi, "smart", or "cloud" features in it. Just the ability to push images into it statically.

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