Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

NeRF: An eventual successor for deepfakes?

metaphysic.ai

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

121–130 of 169 posts

Re: NeRF: An eventual successor for deepfakes?

#121

Post by fxtentacle »

GuB-42 wrote: post #67
RubyRidgeRandy wrote: post #4

Something I've wondered lately is what will life be like in a post-truth society? we already see examples of this now where a large number of people get their news from fake memes on facebook. There are huge swathes of people who live in their own make-believe world, like those believing wholeheartedly that the 2020 election was stolen. What will life be like when you can't trust any video or interview you see becaus…

There has never been a truth society. This tech will certainly be used to frame someone for a crime, like I am sure Photoshop was used in such a way, and thousands of other techniques. And modern technology offers counters. It is an arms race but because of the sheer amount of data that is collected, I think that truth is more accessible than ever. The more data you have, the harder it is to fake and keep consistent.

"Cheerleader's mom created deepfake videos to allegedly harass her daughter's rivals"

"The girl and her coaches were sent photos that appeared to depict her naked, drinking and smoking a vape pen, according to police"

https://abcnews.go.com/US/cheerleaders-mom-created-deepfake-...

Re: NeRF: An eventual successor for deepfakes?

#122

Post by brightball »

RubyRidgeRandy wrote: post #4

Something I've wondered lately is what will life be like in a post-truth society? we already see examples of this now where a large number of people get their news from fake memes on facebook. There are huge swathes of people who live in their own make-believe world, like those believing wholeheartedly that the 2020 election was stolen. What will life be like when you can't trust any video or interview you see becaus…

Honestly, when people have gone so far as to redefine common words it makes it really difficult to have conversations with people.

1. Hate going from one of the most visceral and obsessive emotions that exists to being tossed around at everything

2. The advent of your truth instead of the truth

3. Constant injections of "x" into every existing word apparently?

"Womxn in Mathematics at Berkeley" - https://wim.berkeley.edu/

This is all before we get people to understand that having a discussion where some of their points might not be a strong as they think they are...somehow means you're attacking.

The world that we have created for ourselves over the last 20 years is weird.

Re: NeRF: An eventual successor for deepfakes?

#123

Post by jayd16 »

fxtentacle wrote: post #118
jayd16 wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When you say "everything online" do you mean every untrusted source? Surely the genie is out of the bottle on communication over the web. That local source will have a website. Because of that I feel like we'll always just have to be vigilant, just like we always should have been. After all, local scams still exist. Real humans are behind the bots.

> Real humans are behind the bots. Yes, but those humans are usually anonymous and on the other side of the planet which makes them feel safe. And that allows them to be evil without repercussions. Back in the days, I went to LAN parties. If someone spotted a cheater, they would gang up with their friends and literally throw the offender out of the building. That was a pretty reliable deterrent. But now with all game…

To argue that scams didn't exist or weren't a problem before the internet is pretty indefensible, no matter the anecdotes.

Re: NeRF: An eventual successor for deepfakes?

#124

Post by jl6 »

GuB-42 wrote: post #67
RubyRidgeRandy wrote: post #4

Something I've wondered lately is what will life be like in a post-truth society? we already see examples of this now where a large number of people get their news from fake memes on facebook. There are huge swathes of people who live in their own make-believe world, like those believing wholeheartedly that the 2020 election was stolen. What will life be like when you can't trust any video or interview you see becaus…

There has never been a truth society. This tech will certainly be used to frame someone for a crime, like I am sure Photoshop was used in such a way, and thousands of other techniques. And modern technology offers counters. It is an arms race but because of the sheer amount of data that is collected, I think that truth is more accessible than ever. The more data you have, the harder it is to fake and keep consistent.

I don’t know, it seems like the existence of widespread, easy photo/video/audio faking technology could be a really strong argument for dismissing any purported photo/video/audio evidence.

Wouldn’t it be funny if deepfakes destroyed the blackmail industry?

Re: NeRF: An eventual successor for deepfakes?

#125

Post by toss1 »

adhesive_wombat wrote: post #120
toss1 wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agree, and it's even worse than that An incredibly small minority of people even understand your phrase with any actual fidelity and depth of meaning: >>it can be verified there (including cryptographically, say by signing the file or even using HTTPS) Even fewer of that microscopic minority have and understand how to use the tools required to verify the video cryptographically, AND even fewer know how to fully valid…

> AND even fewer know how to fully validate that the tools themselves are valie (e.g., not compromised by a bogus cert). Kind of, but once you have a single verifiable channel back to the source (in this case, some statement by the president) it's now possible for anyone to construct a web of trust that leads back to that source. For example, multiple trustworthy independent outlets reporting on the same statement in…

>>that's accelerant but not the fuel.

Yes, indeed! Which is why I'm having so much trouble with ppl proposing technological solutions - technically it might solve the problem in some situations, but the bigger problem is indeed some combination of general confusion, highly adversarial information environment laden with disinformation, and people's all-too-frequent love of confirmation bias and willingly believing BS and overlooking warning signs.

I hope we can sort it...

Re: NeRF: An eventual successor for deepfakes?

#126

Post by synu »

HyperSane wrote: post #116
RobertRoberts wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was asked "What are we going to do about Ukraine!?" And I said, "It's a civil war that's been going on for almost 10 years, what is different now?" and their response was "what? I'd never heard that." And I added, "In 2014 there was an overthrow of an elected president there and it started the war." Blank stares. I have a friend who traveled to Europe regularly for tech training, including Ukraine, and he was surpr…

The president that lost power in 2014, Viktor Yanukovych, was a Russian puppet who refused to sign the European Union–Ukraine Association Agreement in favor of closer ties to Russa. The Ukrainian parliament voted to remove him from office by 328 to 0. He then fled to Russia.

It’s hard to fathom believing there’s nothing new or relevant happening with the 2022 invasion, or why if there was a lead-in to the conflict that would be on its own a reason to conclude that there’s nothing to be done now.

Re: NeRF: An eventual successor for deepfakes?

#127

Post by mcphage »

RobertRoberts wrote: post #105
gernb wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was listening to "This American Life" and they had a segment on someone who setup an site to give you a random number to call in Russia where you were supposed to give them info about what's happening in the Ukraine. It was someone shocking to hear their side of the story, that Russia is a hero for helping oppresed Russians in Ukraine. But then I stepped back and wondered, I'm assuming that the story I've been told…

I was asked "What are we going to do about Ukraine!?" And I said, "It's a civil war that's been going on for almost 10 years, what is different now?" and their response was "what? I'd never heard that." And I added, "In 2014 there was an overthrow of an elected president there and it started the war." Blank stares. I have a friend who traveled to Europe regularly for tech training, including Ukraine, and he was surpr…

> what is different now?

Um. Is this a serious question?

Re: NeRF: An eventual successor for deepfakes?

#128

Post by pfisherman »

RubyRidgeRandy wrote: post #4

Something I've wondered lately is what will life be like in a post-truth society? we already see examples of this now where a large number of people get their news from fake memes on facebook. There are huge swathes of people who live in their own make-believe world, like those believing wholeheartedly that the 2020 election was stolen. What will life be like when you can't trust any video or interview you see becaus…

I think that people will adapt. Humans are very clever and have been evolutionarily successful because of the ability to adapt to a wide range of environments.

Think about how devastatingly effective print, radio, and television propaganda at the time each medium was widely adopted compared to how effective they are now. They still work, but for the most part people have caught on to the game and adjusted their cognitive filters.

My guess is that we will see a bifurcation of society into those who are able to successfully weed out bullshit from those who can’t. The people who are able to process information and build better internal models of the world will be more successful, and eventually people will start imitating what they do.

Edit: I do think that these tools coupled with widespread surveillance and persuasion tech (aka ad networks), have set up conditions where the few can rule over the many min a way that was not possible before. I do think some of the decentralized / autonomous organization tech - scaling bottom up decision making to make it more transparent and efficient - is a possible counter. Imo, this struggle between technological mediated centralization and top down enforcement and control vs decentralization and bottom up consensus will be the defining ideological struggle of our time.

Re: NeRF: An eventual successor for deepfakes?

#129

Post by beisner »

notfed wrote: post #84
beisner wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So there are information theoretic ways to certify that media is genuine, if you assume trust at least somewhere in the process. Basically just cryptographic signing. For instance, a camera sensor could be designed such that every image that is captured on the sensor gets signed by the sensor at the hardware level, with a certificate that is embedded by the manufacturer. Then any video released could be verified agai…

> a camera sensor could be designed such that every image that is captured on the sensor gets signed by the sensor at the hardware level A hardware-based private key like this will inevitably be leaked.

Each sensor could have a unique cert

Re: NeRF: An eventual successor for deepfakes?

#130

Post by azinman2 »

pfisherman wrote: post #128
RubyRidgeRandy wrote: post #4

Something I've wondered lately is what will life be like in a post-truth society? we already see examples of this now where a large number of people get their news from fake memes on facebook. There are huge swathes of people who live in their own make-believe world, like those believing wholeheartedly that the 2020 election was stolen. What will life be like when you can't trust any video or interview you see becaus…

I think that people will adapt. Humans are very clever and have been evolutionarily successful because of the ability to adapt to a wide range of environments. Think about how devastatingly effective print, radio, and television propaganda at the time each medium was widely adopted compared to how effective they are now. They still work, but for the most part people have caught on to the game and adjusted their cogni…

I think you’re underestimating the power of cognitive biases and violence from those who only believe the information that want to hear.
Post reply on HN