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Ask HN: How is the remote vs in-person trend looking?

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Re: Ask HN: How is the remote vs in-person trend looking?

#131

Post by ImprobableTruth »

lefstathiou wrote: post #24

Early on (during Covid) I made the decision that remote work was not for our company (SAAS for financial services) and two years in have zero regrets about it. We are clear about our expectations so there are no surprises to employees and new hires (or we filter out people that want it). Most of our clients in financial services have reached the same conclusion. One of my clients at a large bulge bracket said “if the…

>One of my clients at a large bulge bracket said “if these people insist on not being in the office we may just outsource the job for a tenth of the comp”. I think more companies will take that view personally.

That's obviously an empty threat. If they could save 90% by outsourcing, they'd already have done it. The idea that the tech market rate is as high as it is because of good-hearted managers is absolutely laughable.

Re: Ask HN: How is the remote vs in-person trend looking?

#132

Post by upupandup »

I just don't understand why some people are so keen on making in-person or hybrid work, it won't in the long run because you are competing with companies that doesn't have the overhead of an office, HR, logistics etc. This is the new normal, you either accept it or keep trying to go back to what will never be going forward.

I also don't really believe people claiming they are losing productivity in WFH, its most likely that they were never productive to begin with and its becoming magnified.

The latter group often expresses it emotional terms like : not having human interactions, missing out on watercooler talks, acknowledgement. Perhaps these emotions are being surfaced because there is nothing to hide behind anymore.

Re: Ask HN: How is the remote vs in-person trend looking?

#133

Post by chasd00 »

spoonjim wrote: post #55
idiotsecant wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can people really tell anything about your living situation from your teams call background, though? Just aim your camera at a neutral wall and you're good to go. You could be living in a giant palace or a inner city slum and nobody would know the difference.

The marker of low socioeconomic status in a remote environment is disruptions to your video call. Kids crying, people walking through your background, people yelling, neighborhood dogs barking, etc. is something that doesn't get into your call when you're rich.

Mostly right except for kids. All up and down the org chart at my firm there’s been interruptions by children haha. Also, sometimes things just happen no matter who you are. There was a US Supreme Court hearing over video chat and someone on the call flushed a toilet.

https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2020/05/06/politics/toilet-flush-sup...

Re: Ask HN: How is the remote vs in-person trend looking?

#134

Post by enchantments »

lefstathiou wrote: post #24

Early on (during Covid) I made the decision that remote work was not for our company (SAAS for financial services) and two years in have zero regrets about it. We are clear about our expectations so there are no surprises to employees and new hires (or we filter out people that want it). Most of our clients in financial services have reached the same conclusion. One of my clients at a large bulge bracket said “if the…

Is this for your sales team in the US or your engineers in Ukraine (based on your open positions)? Do you manage engineering remotely but make them come into an office together?

Re: Ask HN: How is the remote vs in-person trend looking?

#135

Post by ghaff »

swader999 wrote: post #126
ghaff wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>They'll judge you poorly for spotty or slow internet on calls Of course, realize that there's a good chance there's nothing they can do about that.

Trying different providers and even different routers helped me. Wi-Fi is less reliable generally.

Many of us don't have a choice of different providers. And while I agree that WiFi in particular may not be as good as a wired connection, many people also don't have an Ethernet jack near where they work at home. (I do personally next to where I take my calls.)

Re: Ask HN: How is the remote vs in-person trend looking?

#136

Post by spoonjim »

chasd00 wrote: post #133
spoonjim wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The marker of low socioeconomic status in a remote environment is disruptions to your video call. Kids crying, people walking through your background, people yelling, neighborhood dogs barking, etc. is something that doesn't get into your call when you're rich.

Mostly right except for kids. All up and down the org chart at my firm there’s been interruptions by children haha. Also, sometimes things just happen no matter who you are. There was a US Supreme Court hearing over video chat and someone on the call flushed a toilet. https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2020/05/06/politics/toilet-flush-sup...

Sure, but the richer you are the less it happens, because you have staff to take care of kids, etc. Although I have noticed that kids appear on camera at the most senior and junior levels of the company. If I am working with an low-level assistant to get something done she might have a kid pop on camera and she's super embarrassed about it. If the CFO has his kid wander into the room in an all hands he picks her up and shows her off on camera. You'd like to think that this could normalize it for the assistant but that's of course not how power works.

Re: Ask HN: How is the remote vs in-person trend looking?

#137

Post by ajcp »

ragnot wrote: post #70

We are still full remote and I don't think anyone has any intention to go back to "in-person" honestly. As a side note: I think the reason you are going to find so much friction with this is for the first time in recent history "workers" (specifically software engineers) have incredible leverage over management. I honestly don't think we've seen this since the days of labor unions. Think about it: software engineers…

I wonder if that makes it the best time for software engineers to form a union? I think the conventional wisdom is that unions are formed to benefit those without power otherwise, but would it make sense to unionize to maximize an already outsized position? Would that thereby ensure (to an extent) those proceeds for when a bargaining position might not be as powerful? The Icelandic press industry (I know, just hang in there with me) had a couple of amazing years in the 80s that the journalist(?) unions used as an opportunity to lock down some really progressive benefits that they still exercise today.

Re: Ask HN: How is the remote vs in-person trend looking?

#138

Post by Yhippa »

For some reason, I have in my mind September when we're going to see a lot more RTO of at least 3 days a week.

Also in my mind, companies that are either smaller or have a good idea of what they need their people to do are the ones that are going to be able to thrive and provide full-remote work.

BigCo's are probably going to continue to push for in-person as they are unable to determine what they need from their people so they will substitute face time and meetings to make themselves feel like progress is made.

Random thought: for me, hybrid work as a mostly-remote person was hardest when you had more than one person in a meeting room and the rest were remote.

Re: Ask HN: How is the remote vs in-person trend looking?

#139

Post by wollsmoth »

upupandup wrote: post #132

I just don't understand why some people are so keen on making in-person or hybrid work, it won't in the long run because you are competing with companies that doesn't have the overhead of an office, HR, logistics etc. This is the new normal , you either accept it or keep trying to go back to what will never be going forward. I also don't really believe people claiming they are losing productivity in WFH, its most lik…

I think it varies by person. I'm remote but still go in to the office from time to time and a lot of times the days I go in are my most productive days. But I know it's not the same for everyone.

Re: Ask HN: How is the remote vs in-person trend looking?

#140

Post by wollsmoth »

Uptrenda wrote: post #9
_fat_santa wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Personally I never use easy apply or go through websites, I always talk to a recruiter on LinkedIn. Usually I'll get 1-2 messages per week from recruiters about a position, I'll politely decline but tell them I would like to keep in touch. Whenever I go looking for another gig, all those recruiters are hit up. IMO, having a recruiter helps you cut through a ton of BS like filling out job applications, recruiter takes…

My experience with recruiters has always been negative. Do you mean internal recruiters or external ones?

Most external recruiters aren't that useful in my experience. Unless they happen to have a client you want to connect with at the time you are looking. Internal recruiters have helped speed me through the process in many cases though, so those are worth connecting with imo.
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