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I Finally Found a Solid Debian Tablet: The Surface Go 2

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Re: I Finally Found a Solid Debian Tablet: The Surface Go 2

#151

Post by nicbou »

MonkeyClub wrote: post #53
Moosdijk wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You want an ipad it seems like.

For me the iPad feels too constricting when you want to do anything other than consume content. But I think that's just because I'm accustomed to having direct access to files and filesystems, and the extra later of abstraction (already necessary to visually translate a filesystem) just becomes bothersome. E.g. I still need to cd and ls in a very primitive and visceral way, feel my way around the warren like a mole s…

It's great for reading, sketching and taking notes. It's not a development machine, though some people try really hard to make it so.

I never found a good solution, so I pack my iPad Mini and my Macbook. I just need stronger legs.

Re: I Finally Found a Solid Debian Tablet: The Surface Go 2

#152

Post by w4rh4wk5 »

fomine3 wrote: post #147
Macha wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The iPad is out, too locked down for my tastes. Android is out, they've basically thrown in the towel in this space. Their newest release claims "We're back for real this time", but they already dumped it once. I'd take a desktop with touch experience over a "phone app on big screen" experience 100%. So I've ended up with a Surface Go as my tablet when I replaced my nvidia shield k1 also. The UI can be janky, but hav…

Agree but a cons of Windows tablet is that Kindle app sucks. It's not minor problem since tablet is primary for reading books for me.

I've never used the Kindle app, so I don't know what that user experience is like, but I've been pretty happy with Sumatra PDF for reading EPUBs. Inside the advanced settings you can adjust color, font, and font size. For me, that's all I need from an ebook reader.

Re: I Finally Found a Solid Debian Tablet: The Surface Go 2

#153

Post by nicbou »

Macha wrote: post #56
frou_dh wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a tablet, you'd pick a mediocre tablet experience with a regular desktop experience over a good tablet experience? As a tablet?

The iPad is out, too locked down for my tastes. Android is out, they've basically thrown in the towel in this space. Their newest release claims "We're back for real this time", but they already dumped it once. I'd take a desktop with touch experience over a "phone app on big screen" experience 100%. So I've ended up with a Surface Go as my tablet when I replaced my nvidia shield k1 also. The UI can be janky, but hav…

It comes down to what you want to do with your tablet.

I want to replace paper books and notebooks. The iPad is unrivalled for that. If I need a machine to type on, I need a full OS on a full laptop. I just pack both.

Re: I Finally Found a Solid Debian Tablet: The Surface Go 2

#154

Post by marcosdumay »

solardev wrote: post #125
jlkuester7 wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not disagreeing with you per we, but I will note that the author may be judging the tablet as compared to other mobile devices running Linux. With the exception of the PinePhone and a few other devices Linux on mobile devices is truly painful/broken in most cases (and in ways that make this tablet look almost fully featured...).

Maybe I'm misunderstanding something here, but isn't Android already Linux? What's the advantage of installing another distro? I thought the whole point of Android is to make a curated touch friendly Linux experience. If you want a more traditional distro, wouldn't a touchscreen laptop (yoga etc.) be a better choice, if only for x86 support?

Yes, Android is Linux. That means that you can just install the GNU OS with the kernel that comes with the device, and get a GNU/Linux installation running on top of it.

But by doing that you get to maintain all the malware that comes builtin on the mobile OSes.

The OP wants to replace the kernel. But most mobile devices use very specific hardware that do not have drivers compatible with the standard kernel you get from your distro. Technically, the manufacturer should have to supply you the source of the drivers they use (so you could port them), but good luck enforcing any right of yours against a large company on the legal system (any country's one actually).

Re: I Finally Found a Solid Debian Tablet: The Surface Go 2

#155

Post by dredmorbius »

rovr138 wrote: post #80
LeSaucy wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t think you can do much better than an iPad Pro in the tablet space, super refined tablet experience, combined with the Microsoft rdp app to a vm or other desktop for a full x86 windows env, apple rdp to macs/MacBooks, and blink mosh ssh to Linux systems. Yes running external systems is cheating but the actual end result is insanely functional. Say what you will about iPadOS but it still gets yearly major updat…

I want an iPad (Pro or whatever) with a full OS. I want to run the full browser I want, if needed, I want to be able to load up some code and review/run tests and maybe start coding something simple and keep going. There are apps that kind of help, but they're not the same. I also can't say I'm always online. I went with a Surface Pro. I'm running windows which I don't particularly like, but it'll have to do for now.…

Serious question: why not simply an ultra-light laptop?

I've taken a hard look at what the strengths/weaknesses of tablets are (see my link-drop elsewhere in this subthread), and the one thing they're really good at seems to be reading ebooks. For which a dedicated e-ink ebook reader is far superior.

Almost any productivity task is better done with a keyboard, ergo, laptop.

Video and audio capture are more flexibly and usefully achieved with a dedicated camera or recorder, and both can be extremely inexpensive.

(I've also reasons for wanting my audio/video capture tools to have minimal connectivity and not be part of a surveillance-capitalism platform.)

Handwritten notetaking is another possible application, though having a keyboard available makes typed notes and note-management systems viable. Then there's drawing / sketching. Again, e-ink kworks well for B&W there.

Video can be watched on a laptop. Audiobooks are pretty well suited to an e-ink tablet again.

Re: I Finally Found a Solid Debian Tablet: The Surface Go 2

#156

Post by solardev »

idle_zealot wrote: post #149
solardev wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is that true even if you compile AOSP from source? (not being sarcastic here, just never looked into this)

You lose the spyware if you use AOSP (except any that’s baked into your OEM’s kernel blobs), but you also lose a lot of functionality. You can regain some by using a community-maintained AOSP-based OS like Lineage, but chances are that a bunch of device-specific hardware/software features will still be missing.

I see, thank you for the explanation!

Re: I Finally Found a Solid Debian Tablet: The Surface Go 2

#157

Post by Macha »

w4rh4wk5 wrote: post #152
fomine3 wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agree but a cons of Windows tablet is that Kindle app sucks. It's not minor problem since tablet is primary for reading books for me.

I've never used the Kindle app, so I don't know what that user experience is like, but I've been pretty happy with Sumatra PDF for reading EPUBs. Inside the advanced settings you can adjust color, font, and font size. For me, that's all I need from an ebook reader.

Does Sumatra support reading Amazon's books direct, or do you need to pass them through DeDRM first? Or is there some other store selling DRM-free epubs I'm not aware of?

I end up stripping DRM off mine with Calibre's tools, then reading them on calibre-web.

Re: I Finally Found a Solid Debian Tablet: The Surface Go 2

#158

Post by phren0logy »

eropple wrote: post #132
phren0logy wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That battery life is impressive! Thunderbolt 4 and a better selection of ports than the MacBook Air M1, also. But, as great as the screen is, looks like it falls short of the 12" MacBook screen. Same 8GB of RAM in the base model as the M1, but memory bandwidth not the same. And the processor isn't going to keep up. I mean, it's nice, but I picked the base model M1 Air about a year ago for $750 - still seems like the…

I quite like my work M1 Pro, but (to help coworkers with Mac problems while I was using a ThinkPad) I had an M1 Air 8GB from work for a while and I honestly found it really pretty bad because of the RAM limits. It seems like there's a floor against which MacOS bumps pretty hard if you want to use the machine for development-ish stuff and it reacts really poorly to memory starvation if you get ahead of yourself. Havin…

Agreed, 8 GB is just not enough even for basic needs in the era of remote work and electron apps. I don’t know why they are continuing that as the base in this year’s MacBook Air M2, because it is just a worse user experience. These are already premium computers, even at the base models. I wish Apple would be a little bit more forward thinking about keeping users happy rather than saving a few pennies in the short term.

Re: I Finally Found a Solid Debian Tablet: The Surface Go 2

#159

Post by Macha »

csdvrx wrote: post #59
deepsun wrote: post #4

As for decent powered charger try one from https://frame.work -- it also has both power and USB-C cords detachable, so you can use any other USB-C you like, as well as custom length (or plug) power cords.

> As for decent powered charger try one from https://frame.work -- it also has both power and USB-C cords detachable, so you can use any other USB-C you like, as well as custom length (or plug) power cords. Uh? That's HUGE! I recommend instead a AOHI GaN USB-C PD charger: the 30W is much smaller and sufficient to charge most laptops https://www.amazon.com/dp/B097BWY4WG The chubbier AOHI 65W I got when I thought I may…

> the 30W is much smaller and sufficient to charge most laptops

Even the M1, which is praised for it's power efficiency can hit 40-50W under load. Such a charger will let the battery run down if you actually use your laptop for intensive tasks while charging. I don't think that qualifies as "most laptops" (and forget high end Intel laptops that are more than a generation old, they'd draw more than that watching a 4k movie)

Re: I Finally Found a Solid Debian Tablet: The Surface Go 2

#160

Post by rovr138 »

dredmorbius wrote: post #155
rovr138 wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I want an iPad (Pro or whatever) with a full OS. I want to run the full browser I want, if needed, I want to be able to load up some code and review/run tests and maybe start coding something simple and keep going. There are apps that kind of help, but they're not the same. I also can't say I'm always online. I went with a Surface Pro. I'm running windows which I don't particularly like, but it'll have to do for now.…

Serious question: why not simply an ultra-light laptop? I've taken a hard look at what the strengths/weaknesses of tablets are (see my link-drop elsewhere in this subthread), and the one thing they're really good at seems to be reading ebooks. For which a dedicated e-ink ebook reader is far superior. Almost any productivity task is better done with a keyboard, ergo, laptop. Video and audio capture are more flexibly a…

Sometimes I just want to just browse and consume content and don't need a keyboard. Sometimes I want to annotate and handwrite on something and the ones with keyboards that fold back, become too thick.

The iPad has a great size and depth for this. When I use my wife's the thickness is not bad. If I want to annotate a PDF, I can sit on the couch and it's super easy and not heavy or too thick.

Videos, I can easily remove the keyboard, prop it against something and it doesn't take more space. However, I rarely do this for long periods. My main use to watch videos is to figure something out and take notes.

I want to be able to take handwritten notes, highlight and annotate PDF's, and research using a full featured browser. So it's an in-between. I think the iPad is close. Hardware is there (same CPU/architecture). Just needs software support.

We also have leaned towards mac's just for the UNIX tools but also it has a ton of nice things so that's why I think that the OS would be great. Copy from your computer, paste it on your ipad, keep going or open it through Files.

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