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Wikimedia Enterprise announces Google and Internet Archive as first customers

wikimediafoundation.org

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Re: Wikimedia Enterprise announces Google and Internet Archive as first customers

#101

Post by hourago »

exolymph wrote: post #30

At this point, Wikimedia the organization is parasitic on Wikipedia the open-source information project. The latter generates all the goodwill and the former fucks around doing vanity projects with the ensuing resources. What's that pithy "law" about eventually any organization existing simply to perpetuate itself and serve the insiders who work there, rather than further its mission? Ironically what came to mind is…

> the organization is parasitic on Wikipedia

They get are trying to get financing for their organization offering a service. That is the most win-win situation that you can get.

I am all for adding an Internet-tax to finance projects like Wikipedia, but it is politically easier if it can finance itself.

Re: Wikimedia Enterprise announces Google and Internet Archive as first customers

#102

Post by wincy »

jlarocco wrote: post #99
marcinzm wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pirate Bay is banned in many countries, was raided by the police multiple times, had its founders literally put into jail, had its domains seized, is blocked by Facebook, can't get donations outside of crypto, etc. It's a pretty good example of why you need legal teams for any sort of sustainable effort.

But, despite all of that, they were online for years with a budget that was a fraction of $100 million. And they were hosting content that was blatantly illegal in many countries, while Wikipedia really isn't.

I mean Piratebay is up right now. At least, if not literally, in spirit. I can get torrent magnet links off a site that looks exactly like the same Piratebay and probably not get a virus.

Re: Wikimedia Enterprise announces Google and Internet Archive as first customers

#103

Post by afandian »

zinekeller wrote: post #90
wmfanon9973 wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wikidata is maintained by Wikimedia Deutschland ( https://www.wikimedia.de/ ), not the Wikimedia Foundation.

Can you cite any evidence (even in German)? The only thing I'm sure that was done by WMDE is about Wikivoyage (which is definitely more complicated than it seems, mainly because the English version was a fork of WikiTravel).

Wikidata, both the software and the platform generally, is definitely developed at Wikimedia Deutschland. I’ve met a few of the people involved.

https://wikitech.wikimedia.org/wiki/WMDE

Re: Wikimedia Enterprise announces Google and Internet Archive as first customers

#104

Post by afandian »

exolymph wrote: post #30

At this point, Wikimedia the organization is parasitic on Wikipedia the open-source information project. The latter generates all the goodwill and the former fucks around doing vanity projects with the ensuing resources. What's that pithy "law" about eventually any organization existing simply to perpetuate itself and serve the insiders who work there, rather than further its mission? Ironically what came to mind is…

Another point of reference is the principles for scholarly structure. It has clauses to prevent exactly mission drift and other ills. Not adopted by WMF or WMDE, but in the same approximate space.

https://openscholarlyinfrastructure.org/

Re: Wikimedia Enterprise announces Google and Internet Archive as first customers

#106

Post by hansword »

H8crilA wrote: post #63

For the critics, this is basically a way for Wikimedia to charge for high throughput access from commercial users, as well as normalizing the API. These corporations already crawl the entirety of this space, both the HTML and the wikitext. Why wouldn't they if the license allows it? As long as dumps remain available for free (which as I understand they have to) the community loses nothing, and corporate actors get to…

Yes, contribute a bit more is good. But contribute to what? Server costs are (compared to WMF budget) small, the actual contributors never have and never will see a cent.

Re: Wikimedia Enterprise announces Google and Internet Archive as first customers

#107

Post by ryan_lane »

wmfanon9973 wrote: post #72
zozbot234 wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The latest WMF "vanity project" is Wikidata, started in 2012. It is currently getting more edits than the most popular version of Wikipedia, and has been playing a pivotal role in the "open-source information" ecosystem. If that kind of thing is "parasitic" then maybe we should welcome such parasitism.

Wikidata is maintained by Wikimedia Deutschland ( https://www.wikimedia.de/ ), not the Wikimedia Foundation.

The Wikidata software is extensions to Mediawiki (which is maintained by WMF), and though the extensions are primarily developed by a Wikimedia chapter (Wikimedia Deutschland), it's disingenuous to say that Wikidata is fully maintained by them. Its operations, at the very least, are maintained by WMF, and quite a bit of development and a large amount of code review was done by WMF.

Similarly, the test/dev for Wikidata is part of Wikimedia Cloud services (which I created). That environment is also WMF run.

Re: Wikimedia Enterprise announces Google and Internet Archive as first customers

#108

Post by ryan_lane »

exolymph wrote: post #30

At this point, Wikimedia the organization is parasitic on Wikipedia the open-source information project. The latter generates all the goodwill and the former fucks around doing vanity projects with the ensuing resources. What's that pithy "law" about eventually any organization existing simply to perpetuate itself and serve the insiders who work there, rather than further its mission? Ironically what came to mind is…

It seems like these kinds of reactions to WMF posts are always by the same handful of people, because it's like you copy/paste the same lies into every discussion.

If you're going to make shit up, at least link to the completely open documents they use for planning, funding, and accounting, so we're basing it on the same information.

Re: Wikimedia Enterprise announces Google and Internet Archive as first customers

#109

Post by ryan_lane »

hansword wrote: post #106
H8crilA wrote: post #63

For the critics, this is basically a way for Wikimedia to charge for high throughput access from commercial users, as well as normalizing the API. These corporations already crawl the entirety of this space, both the HTML and the wikitext. Why wouldn't they if the license allows it? As long as dumps remain available for free (which as I understand they have to) the community loses nothing, and corporate actors get to…

Yes, contribute a bit more is good. But contribute to what? Server costs are (compared to WMF budget) small, the actual contributors never have and never will see a cent.

Stop spreading misinformation. The budget data is open. You're discussing server costs, but need to also consider hosting and data center costs, as well as employee salaries. Running Wikimedia is a pretty decent percentage of their budget.

Part of the reason for other parts of the budget is attempting to increase editor numbers in a world where direct readership is declining (because of products like Google's knowledge graph), and improving inclusiveness, so that content will better represent the world. They are also building an endowment to be able to weather bad fundraising years.

Re: Wikimedia Enterprise announces Google and Internet Archive as first customers

#110

Post by ryan_lane »

cgb223 wrote: post #5

So now, if a Google related Wikipedia article has something added to it that Google doesn’t like, they can suggest to Wikimedia they might not renew their contract unless things are “made right” Google is just one example of this. Any company now has a pathway to do so. I think this is terrible incentives, and destroys the goal of having an Encyclopedia free from interference where only truth can come through

WMF has an endowment and Google's donations don't contribute a high enough percentage to substantially change their budgeting.
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