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Deno raises $21M

deno.com

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Re: Deno raises $21M

#201

Post by mmgutz »

threatofrain wrote: post #178
asien wrote: post #159

Quoted post unavailable.

Personally I got the sense that the Go community doesn't really care for web apps or anything too close to React, but maybe I'm just not experienced enough yet with Go. Is there something like CreateRustApp but with Go? https://github.com/Wulf/create-rust-app

I don't think it's needed. The new front-end build tools optimize for production use and have a great developer experience. Use Next.js or any of the many toolkits out there. There will be a lot more support for them too.

I use Go with Next.js and svelte-kit.

Re: Deno raises $21M

#202

Post by stephen »

alexwebb2 wrote: post #197
LAC-Tech wrote: post #184

Does this mean we can finally get a REPL where a file can be loaded, modified, then reloaded, without having to restart the whole thing? Seriously my biggest pet peeve with both deno and node.js. In every other REPL I've used this is basic functionality. When I talk about this to JS people they look at me like I'm from mars.

JS modules can produce side effects on load. Does that present an obstacle to that kind of REPL pattern?

Naive question, but is that dictated in the spec? Probably?

Just wondering that, since Deno is rewriting all of npm anyway, it would have been a great time to revisit some of these historical script-y design decisions, to make JavaScript/TypeScript-at-scale suck less.

Granted, probably too late now, but as-is neither of Deno's url-based imports or sandboxed-by-default changes has seemed worth the migration cost.

But, if they also made something like "everything hot reloads for free" level ergonomic/platform changes, then yeah, I'd be hopping over.

Re: Deno raises $21M

#203

Post by madeofpalk »

jaredcwhite wrote: post #199

The rise of JavaScript-only clouds intended as "defacto" solutions for web development scares the hell out of me. Monocultures are dangerous. At least in the early Node era, it sat alongside all the other flavors of server infra out there with a near-infinite variety of languages, platforms, OSes. Now we're being told that the future of web development is…Deno? That's it? One tool? One language? One platform? Not the…

Granted, I don't pay a lot of attention to it, but I thought Docker(files) ended up being the defacto standard, not Javascript?

I'm sure Deno will tell you the future is Deno. You don't have to believe them.

Re: Deno raises $21M

#204

Post by madeofpalk »

lucacasonato wrote: post #51
caust1c wrote: post #11

The color changing on this page gives me a migraine: https://deno.com/deploy I like Deno in principle, but I'd love to see how Slack, Github and Netlify are using it.

If you have "prefers-reduced-motion" set to true in your browser / OS, the animation will stop :)

Unfortunately browser's don't really give you an easy way to control this. Changing system-wide settings just because one website is bad is quite the ask ask.

Re: Deno raises $21M

#205

Post by Androider »

vcryan wrote: post #188

Deno overstates the problem it is intended to solve because its founders needed to justify achieving funding by being developer-famous. Let's say a company were to adopt this tech over Node, well, it seems like it would be slightly better, but probably not much of a game-changer. I'll leave it to y'all to talk about what tech is truly interesting as I don't want to seem ideological/biased, I just don't see how Deno i…

It's usually not enough to be a bit better than what you're trying to displace, you have to be 10X better than the status quo to have any real impact. For example, SVN tried to be a better CVS, while Git came out of left field and destroyed the competition by being 10X better.

In that, Deno reminds me of the once-hyped Meteor.js. Meteor.js also though that funding could be the answer, but it wasn't. They're both clever, great for demos, but not sufficiently so to overcome the sheer inertia of Node+NPM et al. When something truly 10X better arrives, it will be quite apparent. Just like how React spawned a new generation of frameworks, nothing has unseated it yet because all the competition is React-like and not 10X better.

Re: Deno raises $21M

#206

Post by scarface74 »

TazeTSchnitzel wrote: post #15

> Early in cloud computing, virtual machines were the compute abstraction […] This is funny to me because serverless sounds to me like the return of PHP (etc) shared hosting. What's old is new again?

Virtual machines are still the abstraction. Each Lambda/Fargate (serverless Docker) runs in its own VM.

Re: Deno raises $21M

#207

Post by ricardobeat »

jaredcwhite wrote: post #199

The rise of JavaScript-only clouds intended as "defacto" solutions for web development scares the hell out of me. Monocultures are dangerous. At least in the early Node era, it sat alongside all the other flavors of server infra out there with a near-infinite variety of languages, platforms, OSes. Now we're being told that the future of web development is…Deno? That's it? One tool? One language? One platform? Not the…

It may not be the case right now, but I'm pretty sure their platform will eventually run anything that compiles to WASM. This is just the first step.

Re: Deno raises $21M

#208

Post by PKop »

thegeomaster wrote: post #58
TazeTSchnitzel wrote: post #15

> Early in cloud computing, virtual machines were the compute abstraction […] This is funny to me because serverless sounds to me like the return of PHP (etc) shared hosting. What's old is new again?

I changed my view on this―I hated how things were going full circle. But in reality, human civilization loves overdoing a particular direction and then reverts to the mean. You see this with the economy, moral fashions, everything. I am an optimist in that I (have started to) believe that this slowly allows us to converge on better solutions for everything. PHP was easy to set up, easy to host, easy to understand and…

Thesis, antithesis, synthesis

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dialectic#Hegelian_dialectic

Re: Deno raises $21M

#209

Post by spencerchubb »

jaredcwhite wrote: post #199

The rise of JavaScript-only clouds intended as "defacto" solutions for web development scares the hell out of me. Monocultures are dangerous. At least in the early Node era, it sat alongside all the other flavors of server infra out there with a near-infinite variety of languages, platforms, OSes. Now we're being told that the future of web development is…Deno? That's it? One tool? One language? One platform? Not the…

Deno is only possible because V8 is so hyper-optimized. If you think about it, V8 has to compile/interpret and then run javascript code on the fly after downloading it in the browser. That's how good V8 is. That puts javascript in a unique position to enable something like Deno

So if there was a compiler/interpreter for another language that was close to being as good as V8, then something like this could exist for other languages.

Also, it looks like wasm works on Deno, so that gives some other languages.

Re: Deno raises $21M

#210

Post by stack_framer »

Androider wrote: post #205
vcryan wrote: post #188

Deno overstates the problem it is intended to solve because its founders needed to justify achieving funding by being developer-famous. Let's say a company were to adopt this tech over Node, well, it seems like it would be slightly better, but probably not much of a game-changer. I'll leave it to y'all to talk about what tech is truly interesting as I don't want to seem ideological/biased, I just don't see how Deno i…

It's usually not enough to be a bit better than what you're trying to displace, you have to be 10X better than the status quo to have any real impact. For example, SVN tried to be a better CVS, while Git came out of left field and destroyed the competition by being 10X better. In that, Deno reminds me of the once-hyped Meteor.js. Meteor.js also though that funding could be the answer, but it wasn't. They're both clev…

This explanation resonates with me.

I first saw Ryan Dahl's talk about his Node.js regrets[0] during the early days of the pandemic. I thought I'd be eager to try Deno when it became more mature, but I still haven't tried it. I guess I'm not convinced that it's 10x better than Node.js.

[0] https://youtu.be/M3BM9TB-8yA

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