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Contra Wirecutter on the IKEA air purifier

dynomight.net

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Re: Contra Wirecutter on the IKEA air purifier

#551

Probably more aggro than necessary... Wirecutter takes H13 to be the minimum level that can be considered "HEPA" because that seems to be the "H" in "H13", per the same chart that Dynomight references in Wikipedia (though they cut off that column in their own article).

Yeah this was very bizarre to me. It seems like the author just missed the basic fact that the H13 is the same H that makes it 'true' HEPA.

He can (and did) argue that this distinction doesn't really matter, but the distinction is still part of a well-defined standard that The Wirecutter didn't invent.

Re: Contra Wirecutter on the IKEA air purifier

#552

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Eight years ago, right? Are they refusing now? (Genuinely curious if you've got up-to-date info. If they are terribly biased I want to know it, so I can downgrade my trust, which is why I upvoted the OP about the air purifier.) Also, it's not really clear to me that "independently review" has to mean "we completely isolate any business-related decision-making from editorial functions" as Nextgrid seems to assume.

Well it certainly calls their objectivity into question, and the objectivity is supposed to be the entire point. The way they described the better (and more expensive) desk before the shakedown made it clear that it was the best one. That they changed it to a runner-up after many attempts to solicit a kickback is a seriously bad look. I don’t trust them at all now.

They didn't change it to a runner up—they changed it to an upgrade pick, that is, still the best, but without enough marginal benefit for the substantial marginal cost. Not sure what pricing was like back then, of course, but at this point Wirecutter's recommendations run about seven hundred dollars, and NextDesk's offerings start at eighteen hundred.

Re: Contra Wirecutter on the IKEA air purifier

#553

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A E12 filter filters out 99.5% of particles above 0.3 microns. An H13 filter filters out 99.95% of particles above 0.3 microns. Assuming a volume of 10000 particles above 0.3 microns: An E12 filter will leave 50 particles. An H13 filter will leave 5 particles. The "rootlocus" filter would leave 0.5 particles. So yes, I would say your filter is 100x better because it literally is.

> Assuming a volume of 10000 particles above 0.3 microns: That volume is not the same volume processed by all filters in the same amount of time. In the first minute: E12 filters 10000 particles @ 99.5% performance -> removes 9950, leaves 50 H13 filters 10000 particles @ 99.95% performance -> removes 9995, leaves 5 RLv1 filters 10 particles @ 99.995% performance -> removes 10, leaves 0 RLv2 filters 1000000 particles…

In other words: you miss 100% of the particles you don't circulate

(With apologies to Wayne Gretzky)

Re: Contra Wirecutter on the IKEA air purifier

#554

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> They didn't actually try any of the products themselves (they admitted as much in the article). > I’m going to dissent here on this thread because I’m not seeing any references. OK, here's one such reference in "The Best Baby Formula" [1]: > We didn’t do any testing for this guide, because babies have minds of their own, and it would be impossible to control for all of the variables that might make a baby prefer o…

That seems justified. (IMO I’d want a review of the ingredients, then it’s up to my kid to prefer flavours.) That choice isn’t related to the choices for products for adults, which is what we care about.

Eh, it'd be easy enough to give samples to 10 different babies to at least see if they have any flavors they prefer. Obviously digestive issues are another matter but your kid drinking it without hassle is the first hurdle.

Re: Contra Wirecutter on the IKEA air purifier

#555
post #232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also on headphones, head-fi ( https://www.head-fi.org/ ).

Nope. Head-fi is audiowoo fairy land. Members generally loathe scientific testing and subjective, unsubstantiated claims are regularly made. There's even a cable forum, that, last time I went there, banned double-blind testing completely.

Headfi wasn’t always that way. There was a mass exodus of their scientific-minded members, who dedicated themselves to posting objective, and double-blind tests. Naturally, this created a problem with their advertisers, and most left en masse. Now, the site’s little more than a dumpster dive of anecdotal evidence masquerading as reputable sources.

Re: Contra Wirecutter on the IKEA air purifier

#556
post #497

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Any TV is stupid if you don’t connect it to the Internet.

It boggles my mind that anyone would connect a TV to the Internet (!) Although it wouldn't surprise me at some point if Samsung or other makers started bundling cellular modems in or had deals to have them automatically log into the "free wifi" for the major cable internet providers :p

LG's app interface is good, my TCL just has Roku built in - why wouldn't I?

I'll agree on Samsung's end though. Everyone's Samsung TV I've ever tried has been stupidly laggy.

Re: Contra Wirecutter on the IKEA air purifier

#557

This article actually makes a bunch of claims itself that are false. For example, it claims that the Wirecutter believes air filters work like sieves. Whereas the Wirecutter review page for air purifiers goes into how they do not behave like sieves and also references a NASA study that shows how HEPA filters are good at capturing both particles smaller and larger than the 0.3 micron test standard. It’s pretty obvious…

The Wirecutter article is pretty bad though:

> But it isn’t a true-HEPA purifier, or a very powerful purifier, period. It’s designed to capture PM2.5—that is, particles 2.5 microns in diameter and above, in contrast to the 0.3-micron HEPA standard. That means it’s optimized for larger airborne particles such as pollen and mold spores, rather than for very fine particulates like wildfire smoke, as HEPA filters are.

First, "True-HEPA" has no legal or scientific meaning, so that's not a great look.

Second, and a minor point, the 0.3-micron standard related to the US HEPA standard, not the EU one. It is true that acording to IKEA it doesn't meet the EU standard for HEPA (barely), but we don't know whether it meets the US one. Eliding the difference between different standards isn't helpful

Third, and more seriously, PM2.5 means particles 2.5 microns in diameter and smaller, not larger, and PM2.5 filters are designed to capture particles 2.5 microns and smaller. Mold spores are mostly 4 to 20 microns, pollen averages around 25 microns, so while the IKEA unit may or may not be good at filtering wildfire smoke, it is not optimised for mold and pollen and is probably terrible at it, so that entire line of analysis is just backwards.

That's a lot of errors to pack into a short passage, and it really gives the impression that the author doesn't really understand or care about the topic.

As for CADRs, the linked post digs into the tests pretty well, and I agree with the conclusion - they're not credible. Note specifically that they get a variance of over 2.4 times between tests, and in somes cases measure a CADR vastly higher than the manufacturers claimed CADR. If you're reading a benchmark of a new graphics card and someone ran a benchmark twice and got 100 FPS once and 240 FPS the second time, and they just shrug and pick the number most convenient for their conclusion, you'd probably think something was up.

(That being said, the linked post is a bit iffy too. I'd call out specifically that they could have done a better job of acknowledging that US HEPA standards are a thing, that PM2.5 filters are a thing even if they're not a standard, and that technically E12 filters aren't HEPA, even if that's an arbitrary distinction most people ignore. But they're quite right that the Wirecutter - on the review of the IKEA unit - does in fact seem to think air filters work like sieves. Certainly I can't think of any other explanation for that passage about PM2.5 being good for pollen!)

Re: Contra Wirecutter on the IKEA air purifier

#558

The Wirecutter is a highly flawed review site, but at least it's a real one. There are vanishingly few left for general consumer products. There's WC, Consumer Reports, and what else? They've seem to have all been killed off. When I'm researching some category of product, I feel lucky if I find any professional reviews written by people who have actually touched the thing they're reviewing. I know we've all had the e…

Yeah. I want to read about the real opinions and experiences of real people, not some paid-for marketing piece. I used to search reddit for that kind of thing but it's probably been compromised by now. I wonder if there even is a place that isn't. Real place gets created, real people start going there, marketers realize that's where the people are and immediately start working the place.

Re: Contra Wirecutter on the IKEA air purifier

#559
I'm pretty skeptical (and that's putting it mildly) of any website that uses affiliate marketing links. I can't see how objectivity can survive in that environment.

A concrete example is frequent flyer/travel blogs. I vaguely know the guy who runs the UK's largest one, I've met him in person several times, fairly nice bloke. He's worked very hard to build his site, publishes high-quality content, and is often the first to write about new places and routes of interest. His site has a thriving forum and allows comments on his posts.

He also pushes credit card offers and his site is littered with affiliate links.

Hmm, you say, that's OK, it doesn't necessarily mean he's lost his objectivity.

Except, his articles will say that the best way to book flight or hotel X is via offer Y (coincidentally in affiliate scheme Z, which is where the "book now" link sends you to). Then someone in the comments will pipe up to mention an alternative cashback route that is objectively better. He will delete that comment and any replies to it. So those who aren't aware of what's going on believe his article is the objective truth, and keep feeding the beast by clicking on his affiliate links. They miss out on all the better deals because they involve booking in ways that no-one's allowed to mention on his site.

This has happened over and over again. To me, affiliate marketing is basically a cancer.

Re: Contra Wirecutter on the IKEA air purifier

#560

The Wirecutter is a highly flawed review site, but at least it's a real one. There are vanishingly few left for general consumer products. There's WC, Consumer Reports, and what else? They've seem to have all been killed off. When I'm researching some category of product, I feel lucky if I find any professional reviews written by people who have actually touched the thing they're reviewing. I know we've all had the e…

'Gamers Nexus' (gamersnexus.net) is striving to deliver reliable impartial consumer advice for Computer stuff. Unlike LTT (unless something changed and Linus started hiring people who know what they are doing) GN is leaning heavily on industry best practices instead of 'this feels good' opinions:

We Bought Apple's Old Acoustic Testing Mini-Chamber https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n97ot-gXXVw

This Thing is Huge: Fan Tester Setup, Install, & Overview https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ikRcG1xE3xs

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