Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Why I am not going to buy a computer (1987) [pdf]

thehangedman.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

71–80 of 173 posts

Re: Why I am not going to buy a computer (1987) [pdf]

#71

Post by jklm »

His arguments are, paraphrased:

1. It hurts nature.

2. It's too expensive and destroys existing jobs.

3. It's unlikely that it's better than the current tech.

And that he won't fall for the "propaganda campaign" that says otherwise.

---

What I find super fascinating here is that the arguments back then and now are...extremely similar.

Look at any cutting-edge tech - EVs, crypto, etc. - and you find the same arguments rehashed in different ways. E.g. EVs hurt nature because of battery disposal issues, crypto uses a ton of energy for a slower database.

Food for thought: are we really all that different from Wendell in 2022?

Re: Why I am not going to buy a computer (1987) [pdf]

#72

Post by Hellbanevil »

kurthr wrote: post #11
jimhi wrote: post #3

Holy cow - this guy still does not own a computer. From: https://www.newyorker.com/culture/the-new-yorker-interview/g... "Berry, who is now eighty-four, does not own a computer or a cell phone, and his landline is not connected to an answering machine. We corresponded by mail for a year"

Well, at least only the truly old school Nigerian snail mail scams will get to him! Seriously, if you have parents going into their 70s and 80s you need to really start limiting exposure to scams or the ability to send them money. Otherwise, you won't know until it's too late, their bank account is empty, and their CC are maxed out on cash advances. Also, immediately contact the IRS and Social Security, because they'…

No post body was provided.

Re: Why I am not going to buy a computer (1987) [pdf]

#73

Post by jrumbut »

Wowfunhappy wrote: post #64
bitwize wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Proper UI/UX design is tremendously difficult, which is why software engineers should never attempt it in a user-facing product. When it comes to on-screen text, you must choose your words very carefully, because someone out there will read them the wrong way. Example: in the 90s, Windows, arguably one of the easiest commercial operating systems and certainly the most familiar, used to routinely frighten its users by…

> Example: in the 90s, Windows, arguably one of the easiest commercial operating systems and certainly the most familiar, used to routinely frighten its users by falsely accusing them of crimes. > "This program has performed an illegal operation and will be shut down." At first, I laughed. Then I realized, I think I remember seeing this error message when I was six years old, and being freaked out.

Imagine how lifelong law abiding citizens felt!

I still don't understand how that message escaped being fixed. It wasn't rare. I would estimate a regular computer user would see it monthly? Maybe more?

Re: Why I am not going to buy a computer (1987) [pdf]

#76

Post by User23 »

microtherion wrote: post #61
iRomain wrote: post #27

I laughed so hard at Gordon Inkeles' response. Wendell Berry: My wife types my work on a Royal standard typewriter bought new in 1956 and as good now as it was then. As she types, she sees things that are wrong and marks them with small checks in the margins. Gordon Inkeles: Wendell Berry provides writers enslaved by the computer with a handy alternative: Wife - a low-tech energy-saving device. Drop a pile of handwri…

cf. E.W. Dijkstra in 1986: https://www.cs.utexas.edu/users/EWD/transcriptions/EWD09xx/E... I have often been asked why I don't use [Word Processors], and my honest answer has always been that there is for me so much to write that I cannot afford the use of these time-saving devices. Like Berry, Dijkstra took the existence of menial labor for producing printed or typed products for granted, although, to be fair, for m…

I think he found something about handwriting to be more natural for the manuscripts he wanted to write. A good pen and paper note taking system can allow freer more direct expression than some sort of editor program.

Re: Why I am not going to buy a computer (1987) [pdf]

#77

Post by forgotmypw17 »

_carbyau_ wrote: post #46
forgotmypw17 wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I did give her an old laptop but when the link to "her email" webpage was moved by the ISP she got the error message "It looks like your page has been moved." Innocuous enough error message right? >But this caused her to freak out as clearly "someone" was watching and knew what "her" page was. Ergo "someone" was watching her on the internet. So she turned off the laptop and never opened it again. >On the one hand, s…

While true, there is: "You can please some of the people all of the time, you can please all of the people some of the time, but you can't please all of the people all of the time" For simply changing their webmail page, most of us would adjust pretty quick. If I had been quick enough I could've simply updated her link and she never would have known. But when mental health comes to paranoia, doing things behind her b…

Would you say that building wheelchair ramps is also a waste of time, because you can't please everyone all the time, and they're only a small percentage of the population?

Re: Why I am not going to buy a computer (1987) [pdf]

#78

Post by padheyam »

iRomain wrote: post #27

I laughed so hard at Gordon Inkeles' response. Wendell Berry: My wife types my work on a Royal standard typewriter bought new in 1956 and as good now as it was then. As she types, she sees things that are wrong and marks them with small checks in the margins. Gordon Inkeles: Wendell Berry provides writers enslaved by the computer with a handy alternative: Wife - a low-tech energy-saving device. Drop a pile of handwri…

Most of the responses were pure gems. I wonder if comments on internet sites will be qualitatively better if people are asked to snail mail their comments to the editorial teams (to be formed) of the sites. HN thankfully doesnt need this yet.

Re: Why I am not going to buy a computer (1987) [pdf]

#79

Post by Wowfunhappy »

jrumbut wrote: post #73
Wowfunhappy wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Example: in the 90s, Windows, arguably one of the easiest commercial operating systems and certainly the most familiar, used to routinely frighten its users by falsely accusing them of crimes. > "This program has performed an illegal operation and will be shut down." At first, I laughed. Then I realized, I think I remember seeing this error message when I was six years old, and being freaked out.

Imagine how lifelong law abiding citizens felt! I still don't understand how that message escaped being fixed. It wasn't rare. I would estimate a regular computer user would see it monthly? Maybe more?

I mean, I can totally see how it would happen if you didn't have a UX team, and your developers didn't have any exposure to the concept. The message makes sense to a programmer.

And, they couldn't easily fix anything post-release, right?

(This also makes the original Macintosh interface all the more impressive in my eyes. System 1 is a masterpiece.)

Re: Why I am not going to buy a computer (1987) [pdf]

#80

Post by Ruq »

I really like when he points out his own Standards for Technological Innovation. They are very good points regardless of the current age.

Particularly to me, are the points of repairability, and interfering with real-world relationships.

There are few exceptions to the rule where most systems today cannot be self-repaired, much less taken to a local shop and repaired with off-the-shelf parts (thankfully this is slowly changing for the better.)

In terms of relationships, it would seem to be a mixed bag. In some respects you can communicate across vast distances without a second thought. In others it would seem we are headed to our own doom due to toxicity, disconnect and disassociation from those around us, etc.

Post reply on HN