Wait until you try Microsoft DevOps boards
I fucking hate Jira
251–260 of 539 posts
Re: I fucking hate Jira
#252Earlier quoted context omitted.
9. The text editor is still busted and I just don't understand why. It's one of the most important parts of the UX, please please fix it. Writing any kind of nicely formatted long form posts is a lost cause.
At the very least, use the same markup language for both Confluence and Jira.
Jira/Confluence Cloud use the same markup and editor.
Re: I fucking hate Jira
#253Earlier quoted context omitted.
Does Linus use JIRA on that little project called the Linux kernel? Why is git with good readmes and clear pull requests not enough project management? If you're not doing PR's you are just LARPing software development. I don't hate JIRA, I hate "IT" employees that can't program.
No Linus uses Bugzilla [1]. Have you ever used it? You'll be begging for Jira once you've used Bugzilla. Also Linux doesn't use pull requests. GIT doesn't even know the concept of a PR. You are supposed to generate a patch with 'git format-patch' and submit it to a mailinglist. [1] https://bugzilla.kernel.org/
git doesn't know the concept of a Pull Request? https://git-scm.com/docs/git-request-pull
Bugzilla is for bugs and that's the point, right? A project is not a set of bugs...
Re: I fucking hate Jira
#254Earlier quoted context omitted.
If a tool needs this level of support it's not a good tool and not even a tool - it's the no-code equivalent of a framework. I'd rather pick any other ticketing system which has things done in one way than waste my life configuring jira
This is an inane take. Almost every system we use in a business requires support, and management to be used effectively. You wouldn't fire the people responsible for maintaining your other services. You can either have something incredibly powerful, like Jira, with a lot of sharp edges, or you can use something incredibly similar. The latter would be more like 'no-code' since it's going to be drastically limited in t…
> You can either have something incredibly powerful, like Jira, with a lot of sharp edges...
It's powerful. But I think a bunch of the dislike is because the edges are not sharp. They're very dull. That's why it's so clumsy to use. (Sure, it's still easy to cause damage, but that's not the same thing...)
Disclaimer: I have never actually had to use Jira. This is just my impression from listening to others complain.
Re: I fucking hate Jira
#255The real problem with Jira is that every company adopts it without sufficient support. It needs dedicated admins. You can't just let every single team YOLO things. Unfortunately, what happens is a company adopts it from the start, and then it grows into an impossible-to-use forest where there's no meaningful way to bring things back to actually usable, and everyone is miserable.
Even with zero customization, just using it for a Kanban board is incredibly slow and frustrating. My 2-person team was using the free version of Target Process and needed to migrate to something else since we hit the entity limit, so we went with Jira because it seemed like the industry standard. What we got was the slowest initial page load and slowest interactions of any webapp I've ever used.
After struggling along for 2-3 months, we moved over to Clubhouse (now called Shortcut) and the difference in speed and overall experience is night and day.
Re: I fucking hate Jira
#256Earlier quoted context omitted.
> why don't you think some other company has come along and toppled the Jira crown? Because it's really hard to kill off the market leader when the market leader is embedded into the core of how a company works. I don't buy that it's a matter of competitors not being better. It is more about inertia. The argument you have here could equally be applied to C++ or Cobol "Why is new code being written in these languages?…
You mean as hard as when Git obliterated every other VCS within the span of a few years? If products are better, they get adopted. How do you think every single company in the world started to develop for iOS between 2008 and 2010? When the upside is obvious and the path to transition is well-defined, there is very little friction.
> You mean as hard as when Git obliterated every other VCS within the span of a few years
There's not a concept impedance mismatch going from CVS->SVN->GIT. The concepts are so similar that git-svn exists to convert a SVN repo into a git repo (and a similar conversion tool exists for CVS->SVN)
Jira is so flexible and configurable that no such tool could exist. Migrating to a new tracking system requires that you either lose all currently tracked issues and their history OR you spend the money and effort handcrafting for your org a Jira->Foo translator to preserve some semblance of history. The larger and more diverse the org, the harder such a tool will be to craft.
> How do you think every single company in the world started to develop for iOS between 2008 and 2010?
Because ignoring a company that commands 30% of the market is a bad idea? How do you explain the flop of WebOS which was, IMO, a far better UX and OS compared to either IOS or Android?
Re: I fucking hate Jira
#257I feel like hating on Jira is the pastime that is now passed down from each generation of programmers to the next. I'm going to stick up for Jira. I certainly don't "love" Jira, though I do think they've made significant improvements with "new Jira" (I think they call them team-managed projects now). The problem I have with the incessant Jira bitching is that I rarely feel that bitchers have a true understanding for…
> building a generic project management and tracking tool is a really difficult, hard problem I would say building a good one is an impossible problem, because of conflicting needs both across and within companies. The primary job of Jira isn't to help work get done. It's to give managers and executives feelings of knowledge and control even when that makes everything worse. You don't need fancy planning systems to g…
>>"You don't need fancy planning systems to get good work done"
I mean, as a single individual, in some circumstances, sure.
If we think a bridge or railroad or spaceship get built without fancy planning, we've taken our software engineering paradigm to new level of delusion. Why does engineer or constructor worker understand that you need planning to align thousands of people over many years to build a great big thing, but we feel in software we are just too darn special of snowflakes to need or agree to that?
Sorry if I got your comment way out of context or scope, but it just struck me as a very circumstantial statement, but one that is bandied a lot as a generically applicable one - which it isn't. For many things you need very fancy planning indeed.
Re: I fucking hate Jira
#258I'm fine with Jira now. As long as I don't have to use it that much. I agree about conversation being a second class citizen. I wish I could get integration with my mac notification system more easily. But the positive is that I can do a screen recording and drag and drop that video straight into a comment which is cool
Re: I fucking hate Jira
#259I don't really get the hate to be honest. Maybe it's just me, but our DevOps team seems to have squeezed the best out of Jira. They organized the workflow very well, the Bitbucket Integration is seemless and I can easily get to the builds of my current issue and see what happens there.
The only gripe I have about Atlassian suite is confluence. It's a mess.
I think it really depends on how Jira and the overall workflow is taken care of. For our part, it has been a pretty good experience and the DevOps team used the APIs pretty well and wrote their own tools.
To be honest, I don't have used many other tools, but it seems like our company has made a good choice in configuring the whole system "just right".
Re: I fucking hate Jira
#260I feel like hating on Jira is the pastime that is now passed down from each generation of programmers to the next. I'm going to stick up for Jira. I certainly don't "love" Jira, though I do think they've made significant improvements with "new Jira" (I think they call them team-managed projects now). The problem I have with the incessant Jira bitching is that I rarely feel that bitchers have a true understanding for…
Same here, I really don't get the cargo cult hate against Jira. Before I got to use Jira for the first time around 2006, everything I used before was crap, either in-house solutions out of CGI scripts or crap like ClearQuest. Stuff like Trello just seems too basic for typical enterprise workflows that overlap sprint planning, with project roadmap, milestones and change requests, mapping of tickets to source code, pul…
I think the problem is not what it does or solve. I have used jira in 8 companies, maintained an instance in 2 of them and I have never seen a fast one nor figured out to make them fast.
Any single click you do on it reminds you of the time when people were waiting literally minutes to be able to do anything when booting windows on a laptop with 5400rpm hard disk.
Whatever help it is for your company, it makes you pay for it with billions of swears.