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Harming the ‘outgroup’ linked to elevated activity in the brain reward circuitry

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Re: Harming the ‘outgroup’ linked to elevated activity in the brain reward circuitry

#111

Post by int_19h »

feet wrote: post #104
int_19h wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But what kind of policy does that opposition to large businesses translate to? How do you prevent them from actually arising? Left answer to that is that large businesses are the result of unbounded concentration of capital. Left authoritarians (the ones I think you refer to as Marxists? even though not all of them are, and not all Marxists are authoritarian) want to limit it by state action. Left libertarians think…

That's what I'm wondering. Maybe we agree about the apparent root cause of the issue but we need a tangible solution to it, which could be restructuring ownership of businesses to better suit the people that make up those businesses. Regulation is a way to do that, or other things. But whatever we do will take some sort of regulation, or those same people who have too much money and power are going to keep doing the…

> but whatever we do will take some sort of regulation

Not necessarily. For example, government reducing the scope of property right protection is less regulation, not more.

Re: Harming the ‘outgroup’ linked to elevated activity in the brain reward circuitry

#112

Post by JellyBeanThief »

charlie0 wrote: post #45

In otherwords, water is wet. It's very easy to see that tribal behavior is hardwired into the brain. One just has to look at history and current events to see that. I own a sports motorcycle. One of the first things you learn at the track is that your initial instincts in certain situations are wrong because physics says so. During the course you learn to remold or even completely change your instincts. I've often wo…

> It's very easy to see that tribal behavior is hardwired into the brain. One just has to look at history and current events to see that.

There are some people who would take issue with this. Their view being that one just has to look at history and current events to see the influence of Satan in human affairs.

It's tiresome when people complain about scientific research seeking to prove obvious things. One of science's most important lessons is that what's obvious and what's true are frequently not the same.

Re: Harming the ‘outgroup’ linked to elevated activity in the brain reward circuitry

#113

Post by katzgrau »

yieldcrv wrote: post #47
katzgrau wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It seems the same behaviors exist in the absence and presence of that religion Right, just humans doing their thing and twisting literally anything to justify their pursuit of power. Christianity not necessary. But there's something to be said for a set of values that emphasizes love, empathy, and reciprocity, regardless of the religion.

> But there's something to be said for a set of values that emphasizes love, empathy, and reciprocity, regardless of the religion. Such as how often the religious one fails to do that? My impression is that there is a recurring theme that it is violent towards outgroups and even more violent towards ingroups that don’t conform exactly. Leaving only compassion towards an ever splintering sect for the brief time everyo…

> In any case, what do you see?

I see that failing to practice what is preached does not invalidate the message.

Humans make lots of mistakes and the consequences of that are reflected in all of our institutions. Thankfully, those institutions eventually die away and new, hopefully improved ones grow in their place until the cycle repeats. Happens on all scales.

Re: Harming the ‘outgroup’ linked to elevated activity in the brain reward circuitry

#114

Post by ChrisMarshallNY »

dahart wrote: post #89
ChrisMarshallNY wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, considering that we have an extremely large number of folks that refuse to take treatments that would save their own lives, as well as the lives of those around them, and the Venn diagram of those folks, and ones that want to hurt "others," has a significant overlap, what odds do you give, of them participating in the treatments? One word: "Miranda." https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1hVuzOamXEk

I don’t know, but I don’t see any reason to be skeptical that the future can’t improve, given history. You could have made the same argument about most medical treatments 400 years ago, and it’d turn out to be more or less completely wrong.

Fair enough.

I would caution about treatments that are designed to affect that fundamental a level of "being human," though. That clip I referenced was from the movie Serenity, and "Miranda" was a planet, where they tried pretty much exactly what you are talking about. It was fiction, but there's a road, leading somewhere, reputed to be paved with good intentions...

Re: Harming the ‘outgroup’ linked to elevated activity in the brain reward circuitry

#115

Post by mensetmanusman »

sva_ wrote: post #29
mensetmanusman wrote: post #7

The Germans even have a word for it: Schadenfreude It comes from envy, the second deepest level in Dante’s Inferno. Dante’s cure for envy was sewing the eyes shut.

I don't think Schadenfreude is dependant on whether or not the person is in the ingroup/outgroup.

It means having pleasure at some other person’s pain

Re: Harming the ‘outgroup’ linked to elevated activity in the brain reward circuitry

#116

Post by [deleted] »

ChubbyGlasses wrote: post #88
charlie0 wrote: post #45

In otherwords, water is wet. It's very easy to see that tribal behavior is hardwired into the brain. One just has to look at history and current events to see that. I own a sports motorcycle. One of the first things you learn at the track is that your initial instincts in certain situations are wrong because physics says so. During the course you learn to remold or even completely change your instincts. I've often wo…

> It's very easy to see that tribal behavior is hardwired into the brain All this study showed was that it was present in adult men, nothing about whether or not this is learned behavior or instinctual, or gender differences.

[deleted]

Re: Harming the ‘outgroup’ linked to elevated activity in the brain reward circuitry

#117

Post by musicale »

charlie0 wrote: post #45

In otherwords, water is wet. It's very easy to see that tribal behavior is hardwired into the brain. One just has to look at history and current events to see that. I own a sports motorcycle. One of the first things you learn at the track is that your initial instincts in certain situations are wrong because physics says so. During the course you learn to remold or even completely change your instincts. I've often wo…

"Infants as young as nine months old prefer individuals who are nice to people like them and mean to people who aren’t like them, according to a new study published in Psychological Science, a journal of the Association for Psychological Science."

https://www.psychologicalscience.org/news/releases/babies-pr...

On the other hand:

"People have found that even by 18 months of age, children have expectations about how things should be shared fairly."

https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-19421644

Re: Harming the ‘outgroup’ linked to elevated activity in the brain reward circuitry

#118

Post by r2_pilot »

wffurr wrote: post #95
r2_pilot wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do you say you associate with the University of Mississippi without saying that you associate with them? Ha. I work there and went to school there too, so those first few sentences(well, except for the playoffs remark lol) sound very familiar.

Class of '04, Computer Science. Hotty Toddy.

Fun times. You may remember me if you recall someone with a common first name and the last name of a bird(was there starting in 04); I certainly stayed around there long enough lol. Tended to keep to myself, though.

Re: Harming the ‘outgroup’ linked to elevated activity in the brain reward circuitry

#119

Post by feet »

int_19h wrote: post #111
feet wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's what I'm wondering. Maybe we agree about the apparent root cause of the issue but we need a tangible solution to it, which could be restructuring ownership of businesses to better suit the people that make up those businesses. Regulation is a way to do that, or other things. But whatever we do will take some sort of regulation, or those same people who have too much money and power are going to keep doing the…

> but whatever we do will take some sort of regulation Not necessarily. For example, government reducing the scope of property right protection is less regulation, not more.

Okay how do they do that without regulation

How does a government do anything without regulation? Is regulation not what government literally does?

Re: Harming the ‘outgroup’ linked to elevated activity in the brain reward circuitry

#120

Post by sitkack »

bseidensticker wrote: post #78
sitkack wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They themselves might have cared, but damn if I wear a purple shirt in Seattle folks are like Go Huskies to me, to the point where I think twice about putting it on or wearing it outside the house. I could give a damn about sports or nationalism, but lots of other idiots do.

I think it's a little unfair to call people idiots for something that's extremely hardwired into their brains.

That is why we go to great lengths to civilize ourselves. Sports fanaticism is a fetal nationalism. Maybe we should challenge our hardwired programming, it does seem to offer a lot of control in our actions.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Football_hooliganism_in_the_Un...

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