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Steve Jobs' memo to startups

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Re: Steve Jobs' memo to startups

#81

Post by away »

pg wrote: post #80
breck wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> We were not interested in online stores. Some of the problems were kind of interesting, but neither me nor Robert nor Trevor thought of Viaweb as our life's work. 'How to find your "life's work"' might make a great essay. I think the majority of founders find themselves a few years in working on ideas they aren't crazy about. In a sense founders get married to ideas too young, realize it's not a perfect fit, and th…

http://paulgraham.com/love.html http://paulgraham.com/hs.html

Well you obviously weren't doing what you love with viaweb if your entire goal was to sell it to turn a profit so that you'd never have to deal with it again. And Steve's assertion is not about work ethic, it's about building a "real company". I don't think Steve would consider you to be a real entrepreneur. In his biography, it's stated several times how he doesn't want to make things just because people want them, which is directly against your beliefs in pandering to the masses.

Re: Steve Jobs' memo to startups

#82

Post by saturdaysaint »

Ha, he must have forgotten offering to sell Apple to Commodore back in the Apple I days for a few hundred thousand dollars. Not to say that we should punish people whose views change, but it does seem that a lot of his success in Apple's early days was based on quickly and smartly capitalizing on small projects (eg quickly bringing Woz's engineering feats to market), not necessarily building the enduring platform that became his mission. From the Isaacson bio, he strikes me as a gambler/experimenter whose first company (thanks to much skill, foresight and luck) just so happened to make sense as a long term concern.

Re: Steve Jobs' memo to startups

#83

Post by alecbenzer »

I think the guts of what he's saying is just "I hate when people call themselves 'entrepreneurs', when really they just want to get rich quick."

edit: quotes like this make me feel like I better understand how Jobs really might have thought (as opposed to how some of his fanboys think, which is what I kind of assume he would think like). Another quote I like is this one:

> We’re born, we live for a brief instant, and we die. It’s been happening for a long time. Technology is not changing it much – if at all.

Re: Steve Jobs' memo to startups

#84

Post by gizmo »

pittsburgh wrote: post #28

Between this post and comments from startup school along the same lines, there seems to be a lot of people complaining about founders looking to make a quick buck without having to work hard for it. I live in SF. I'm running a startup, and many of my friends are as well. Where are these lazy, get rich quick people I keep reading about? Am I just lucky to only be surrounded by hard-working entrepreneurs who are trying…

My guess is that we hear disproportionally much about those companies that are built to flip.

Re: Steve Jobs' memo to startups

#85

Post by podperson »

pg wrote: post #24

I can't say he was mistaken, since he was only saying he disliked it. But I don't think there's anything wrong with selling a company at any stage. Steve's problem with selling seemed to be that you're shirking work by doing it. But that isn't necessarily, or even usually, true. A lot of people who sell startups go on to do other things, and often bigger things. If we were still running Viaweb, we could not have star…

I think this quotation (which I liked when I read it at the end of the biography, and which made me think of you at the time) strikes a bit of a sore point.

In the end, some things we do for money and others for love. I think Steve Jobs saw himself as someone who almost always did things for love. He saw making money as simply being a way to fund the next project (which is how artists in general feel).

It's interesting that your response to this quotation is:

"Steve's problem with selling seemed to be that you're shirking work by doing it."

I think that's part of it, but the other part is that you're not doing what you're doing with the right frame of mind.

"A lot of people who sell startups go on to do other things, and often bigger things."

Why is "bigger" in this sentence rather than some other word? "Better" for example.

One of my favorite quotations in the book comes from Larry Ellison. He says he was complaining to Steve Jobs that his plan for turning Apple around (the reverse takeover of NeXT) wasn't going to make either of them nearly as much money as his plan (buying Apple and giving Steve 25%) would and Jobs replied (from memory, so it's probably inaccurate): "That's why you need to have me as a friend, Larry. You don't need any more money."

Re: Steve Jobs' memo to startups

#86

Post by hedgehog »

pg wrote: post #31
kenjackson wrote: post #21

PG wrote a good post on this topic (a counterpoint I would argue). Unfortunately I can't find it. But it's about why selling your company makes sense -- why you should give it to people who are optimzied for running a business. Or something to that effect. Probably worth rereading if I could find it.

I think this may be the one you mean: http://paulgraham.com/prcmc.html

There's a typo down in the credits (Jessica's name).

Re: Steve Jobs' memo to startups

#87

Post by RussRomStanBety »

away wrote: post #81
pg wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

http://paulgraham.com/love.html http://paulgraham.com/hs.html

Well you obviously weren't doing what you love with viaweb if your entire goal was to sell it to turn a profit so that you'd never have to deal with it again. And Steve's assertion is not about work ethic, it's about building a "real company". I don't think Steve would consider you to be a real entrepreneur. In his biography, it's stated several times how he doesn't want to make things just because people want them,…

I don't think Steve Jobs would ever say anything of sorts. Jobs did the exact same thing with NeXT. Does that mean that he didn't consider himself an entrepreneur? Human emotion plays a big role in our decision making and you can't have the same feelings for every project you start.

Re: Steve Jobs' memo to startups

#88

Post by staunch »

RussRomStanBety wrote: post #87
away wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well you obviously weren't doing what you love with viaweb if your entire goal was to sell it to turn a profit so that you'd never have to deal with it again. And Steve's assertion is not about work ethic, it's about building a "real company". I don't think Steve would consider you to be a real entrepreneur. In his biography, it's stated several times how he doesn't want to make things just because people want them,…

I don't think Steve Jobs would ever say anything of sorts. Jobs did the exact same thing with NeXT. Does that mean that he didn't consider himself an entrepreneur? Human emotion plays a big role in our decision making and you can't have the same feelings for every project you start.

He didn't start NeXT with the intention of selling it. He was trying re-create Apple from scratch. Instead he ended up parlaying it into a take-over of Apple and re-created it from within.

I'm not weighing in on the definition of "entrepreneur" here, just pointing out why NeXT isn't a counter example.

Re: Steve Jobs' memo to startups

#89

Post by pg »

away wrote: post #81
pg wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

http://paulgraham.com/love.html http://paulgraham.com/hs.html

Well you obviously weren't doing what you love with viaweb if your entire goal was to sell it to turn a profit so that you'd never have to deal with it again. And Steve's assertion is not about work ethic, it's about building a "real company". I don't think Steve would consider you to be a real entrepreneur. In his biography, it's stated several times how he doesn't want to make things just because people want them,…

I'm not sure where you got the idea that I believe in "pandering to the masses," but maybe this will cure that misconception: http://paulgraham.com/usa.html.

Re: Steve Jobs' memo to startups

#90

Post by EGreg »

pg wrote: post #24

I can't say he was mistaken, since he was only saying he disliked it. But I don't think there's anything wrong with selling a company at any stage. Steve's problem with selling seemed to be that you're shirking work by doing it. But that isn't necessarily, or even usually, true. A lot of people who sell startups go on to do other things, and often bigger things. If we were still running Viaweb, we could not have star…

I found that like Steve, I tend to dream big. But at the same time I don't have any big connections.

My advice to entrepreneurs would be to get the right people involved your first venture, even if it means giving up way over 50% of your company. Because it's better to exit a successful venture, with money, connections and a track record, than own close to 100% of your first venture and spending years growing it. Chances are, this isn't your last idea and you will want to start other companies in the future. When you do, you'll have more money, resources, connections, and people willing to fund you (if you want) as a serial entrepreneur.

That said, I was never able to do it myself. My first project out of the gate is super ambitious and aims to change the face of the social internet, help people accomplish things in the real world, and improve privacy for everyone.

It's coming along and we have over 30k daily users. http://qbix.com

But it took a long time to get here. And now I am thinking that we might just be able to make it on our own steam.

So in a way, I am kind of pursuing my dream, and never had the time to start and exit a successful, but ultimately temporary, venture.

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