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A religious sect landed Google in a lawsuit

nytimes.com

531–540 of 582 posts

Re: A religious sect landed Google in a lawsuit

#531

The leniency in opinion this thread has on cults is concerning.

Eh, I don't know. I'm friends with several people who grew up in this cult, two of whom are still peripheral to it because their families are still involved.

The cult definitely has a lot of weird and sketchy takes. And the leader definitely has a lot of sketchy stuff (particularly in the past) around younger male members, though there seems to be an attitude around it among the Fellowship people that the allegations aren't black and white -- these people aren't thinking of what has happened as sex trafficking or grooming.

For my friends who are still peripheral? Their experience is primarily of a loving community (with some definite weird crap and skeletons in the closet). They're well-educated and fairly skilled in their fields, and while they have some strange (primarily Buddhist and Sufi-inspired, plus some more niche California-original stuff) beliefs, they don't push those beliefs on people. They do understand that Fellowship is a cult, though as far as cults go it's on the less-nuts end, and they have a murky relationship with that fact. Lots of people who live in the Fellowship community in Oregon House aren't actually members, as well -- this particular cult doesn't try to separate its followers from the world.

So when I read this, the hiring stuff looks sketchy, but it's not uncommon at all. The wine procurement, as others have noted, appears not to be clear-cut as the winery is owned by a former member of the cult, and not the cult itself or current members -- it should be looked-into but may be above board. The firing? It should be investigated, sure, but he (as a contractor) was stirring up trouble in a team because a lot of team members were either members or peripheral to (and in my experience, the latter tends to be more common for tech people) the Fellowship community in Oregon House where the cult leader has pretty likely done some very bad stuff. But have the people on that team participated in the bad stuff? The author assumes it, but I don't think that's a good default assumption. I'd assume basically all of these people were raised in the community, and that many or most are not actively involved in the cult itself, because that seems to be the standard story there.

I'm not saying Fellowship isn't sketchy, or that the allegations shouldn't be investigated. I just think there's a wide spectrum of cults (including some that self-describe as cults and are totally voluntary and don't brainwash -- if you meet enough people in the Bay Area you'll eventually stumble on some), and that this one is closer to the level of sketch you'd expect in a small-town evangelical church with some skeletons than something like Jim Jones, etc.

Re: A religious sect landed Google in a lawsuit

#532

Let me get this straight. This guy's coworkers may or may not have been in a cult. So what? They didn't seem to bother him at work and as far as I can tell it didn't affect his job. But he wanted to turn them in anyways? If they were doing something illegal, tell the police. If they were doing something unethical at work, inform hr. Otherwise keep your nose out of it

No post body was provided.

Re: A religious sect landed Google in a lawsuit

#533

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where did you hear such a thing? As a Catholic, I regularly attend Church and we have many people (even entire families) who either join after a long period of being away or leave the faith all together. We miss them of course but no one sends them death treats. Additionally, many people move between denominations. Perhaps you are confusing those with real cults such as: Christian Science, Jehovah's Witnesses, Mormon…

The Catholic Church in a number of European countries stopped processing requests to formally deregister people, due to mass departures after the sexual abuse revelations, which may be what they're referring to. For instance, https://www.notme.ie

Did the Catholic church in Ireland have a register of people who were Catholic? Which other countries have this?

I've just never heard of such a thing.

Re: A religious sect landed Google in a lawsuit

#534

Let me get this straight. This guy's coworkers may or may not have been in a cult. So what? They didn't seem to bother him at work and as far as I can tell it didn't affect his job. But he wanted to turn them in anyways? If they were doing something illegal, tell the police. If they were doing something unethical at work, inform hr. Otherwise keep your nose out of it

Favoritism and enriching themselves with supplying wine to Google for their events. RTFA

Re: A religious sect landed Google in a lawsuit

#535

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The difference is that Islam proscribes death for apostates very clearly in its laws, whereas catholicism does not. You're on a list, like a birth certificate. In general, you cannot force another person to erase their memory of you, but certainly not killing you would be good. It's rare in the US, but it does happen in other parts of the world (killed for being apostates). Not going to comment on anything else, just…

While no country actually executes people for apostasy from Catholicism today, the prescribed punishment under canon law was death by burning.

That doesn't seem right either. Do you actually have any evidence for what you're saying?

Re: A religious sect landed Google in a lawsuit

#536

I thought this was going to be dated years ago, last I ran into this shit it was the summer after Snowden. Google folks can be hella elitist, but at least at IBM they wait til they leave the company to join cults :-) >...she quit her job at IBM to become, in her words, a "full time pop star and cult leader." She's released several homemade, cybertwee-aesthetic music videos, which criticize consumerism and promote spi…

Oregon House is actually in California: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oregon_House,_California

It's a confusing name.

Re: A religious sect landed Google in a lawsuit

#537

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is hiring discrimination alleged to have happened? IIRC, the only decision that is noted in the blog post is the promotion of Dan (who is not in the cult), and the mysterious termination (for which we have no context or details, and the author feels it was orchestrated by the aforementioned Dan). While I'm sure there's lots of be concerned about with respect to the cult, I'm not sure it's Google's business to ask abo…

>Is hiring discrimination alleged to have happened Yes, the potential nepotism involved with nearly 50% of a 25 person group all belonging to the cult.

I don't think you read my comment. There are lots of ways that you can end up with a concentration of a particular ethnicity/religion/etc. It is unreasonable to immediately assume that it is a result of nepotism, and the specific facts matter quite a lot. People often work with and start companies with people from their community, and as a result they are often a large part of their professional network. It's only nepotism if those people are favored over others.

Re: A religious sect landed Google in a lawsuit

#538
post #517

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is not recognized or registered with the NLRB, they don't merely not have a contract - they do not have the legal right to negotiate a contract either.

The technical term is a "minority union" all unions start as minority unions. It's the first part of a union's lifecycle. To register with the NRLB they need to reach a certain percentage of employees. 30% I believe is the correct number at which elections can be held. After a successful election then the NLRB can certify your Union as a collective bargaining representative. Collective bargaining is an NRLB process s…

Eh, I'm not sure that is an accurate description of what has happened.

"Minority unions" as AWU has structured itself are not a typical part of the "union's lifecycle" - usually a central union organization will organize a vote drive but at no point is it a "member's only"/minority union at the company. There are notable exceptions like UAW Local 42.

Re: A religious sect landed Google in a lawsuit

#539
post #390

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That'd be essentially a group legal insurance plan - something many employers offer anyway - and you don't really need a union to join one (or offer one, if you wanted to).

I very much doubt companies are going to pay for your lawyers to sue them with.

Legal plan is usually provided by the third party and paid by the employee. The company essentially just rents out the placement in their HR system - but the same plan may be also available independently, there's nothing forcing it to go through the HR specifically.

Re: A religious sect landed Google in a lawsuit

#540
post #389

Not the main topic of the article but I was surprised the author is unemployed after 15 months. Is it that hard to find any job as a video producer? There must be some other companies doing the same as Google... I have no idea what that job market looks like, just sounded surprising to me.

Nice attempt at character assassination. Here's a more likely explanation. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blacklist_(employment)

How that's "assassination"? I asked a simple question, because I had no idea how the market for video producers looks like - I never worked as one. Maybe you're looking a bit too hard for a reason to be offended and outraged? Not everybody is out to get you.
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