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SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking Elon Musk

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Re: SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking Elon Musk

#492
post #459

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe they actually believed his statements regarding unlimited free speech. It's not backed by evidence but SpaceX does attract dreamers.

The other thread is full of this nonsense. You give the impression that you believe that free speech absolutists think you ought to be allowed to walk up to your CEO and tell him to go fuck himself, without retaliation. What other things would you have us believe that free speech absolutists would allow? Catcalling coworkers, perhaps? Threatening to murder someone's children? No, you just want to snipe at Musk, and y…

His actions show that he considers calling someone a child molester to be acceptable speech so it isn't too much to think that much more polite speech he would not have an issue with.

Re: SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking Elon Musk

#493

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> A lot of people (myself included) really respect SpaceX and I think that's the last pillar on which Elon's reputation stands. Tesla honestly isn't that interesting and there's a real chance it gets eaten alive as other car manufacturers have caught up. Build quality wise? Definitely, Tesla has a lot of issues there which the established industry has ironed out and perfected over the last hundred years. Other proble…

Yeah, I stopped reading at the assertion that other car companies have caught up to Tesla. Lots of people have not internalized what's going on at Tesla. They still seem to be stuck on the idea that when the large, experienced auto manufacturers start really ramping up EVs, Tesla will be swamped. What seems to have gone unnoticed is that Tesla has significantly higher margins per vehicle than all other major automake…

> Tesla has significantly higher margins per vehicle than all other major automakers, including Toyota.

I feel like this is because they charge BMW prices for less than Honda quality, especially with the Model 3. Maybe they can keep this up, but we’ll see. Tesla tech is certainly better than most if not all and is a huge selling point.

Re: SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking Elon Musk

#494
post #459

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe they actually believed his statements regarding unlimited free speech. It's not backed by evidence but SpaceX does attract dreamers.

The other thread is full of this nonsense. You give the impression that you believe that free speech absolutists think you ought to be allowed to walk up to your CEO and tell him to go fuck himself, without retaliation. What other things would you have us believe that free speech absolutists would allow? Catcalling coworkers, perhaps? Threatening to murder someone's children? No, you just want to snipe at Musk, and y…

Did you read the letter? No where does it tell musk to go fuck himself. That’s your characterization.

I read the letter, and thought it was reasonable. If it was my company, I would allow it. Been a founder several times, so that’s not just wild speculation. The only way to get your reading of it is if you have super thin skin and can’t take any criticism.

Re: SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking Elon Musk

#495
post #399

seems kinda hypocritical. would be scared to go to mars with this guy.

I don't see why it is hypocritical.

I am pro free speech, but would never dream of using company resources to try to publicly embarrass my CEO. And certainly not when the issue at hand is not related to company performance.

> would be scared to go to mars with this guy.

Anyone who is against Musk will add this to their litany of complaints. Anyone who loves him will be baffled why this is a story ;)

As an aside, even negative publicity is publicity, and I imagine that this whole Twitter deal will lose Elon gobs of cash, but make his other companies more valuable. "Distancing themselves from Elon Musk", from a purely capitalist perspective, sounds like a bad bet.

Re: SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking Elon Musk

#496
The actual letter, published by The Verge: https://www.theverge.com/2022/6/16/23170228/spacex-elon-musk...

=====================

An open letter to the Executives of SpaceX,

In light of recent allegations against our CEO and his public disparagement of the situation, we would like to deliver feedback on how these events affect our company’s reputation, and through it, our mission. Employees across the spectra of gender, ethnicity, seniority, and technical roles have collaborated on this letter. We feel it is imperative to maintain honest and open dialogue with each other to effectively reach our company’s primary goals together: making SpaceX a great place to work for all, and making humans a multiplanetary species.

As SpaceX employees we are expected to challenge established processes, rapidly innovate to solve complex problems as a team, and use failures as learning opportunities. Commitment to these ideals is fundamental to our identity and is core to how we have redefined our industry. But for all our technical achievements, SpaceX fails to apply these principles to the promotion of diversity, equity, and inclusion with equal priority across the company, resulting in a workplace culture that remains firmly rooted in the status quo.

Individuals and groups of employees at SpaceX have spent significant effort beyond their technical scope to make the company a more inclusive space via conference recruiting, open forums, feedback to leadership, outreach, and more. However, we feel an unequal burden to carry this effort as the company has not applied appropriate urgency and resources to the problem in a manner consistent with our approach to critical path technical projects. To be clear: recent events are not isolated incidents; they are emblematic of a wider culture that underserves many of the people who enable SpaceX’s extraordinary accomplishments. As industry leaders, we bear unique responsibility to address this.

Elon’s behavior in the public sphere is a frequent source of distraction and embarrassment for us, particularly in recent weeks. As our CEO and most prominent spokesperson, Elon is seen as the face of SpaceX—every Tweet that Elon sends is a de facto public statement by the company. It is critical to make clear to our teams and to our potential talent pool that his messaging does not reflect our work, our mission, or our values.

SpaceX’s current systems and culture do not live up to its stated values, as many employees continue to experience unequal enforcement of our oft-repeated “No Asshole” and “Zero Tolerance” policies. This must change. As a starting point, we are putting forth the following categories of action items, the specifics of which we would like to discuss in person with the executive team within a month:

Publicly address and condemn Elon’s harmful Twitter behavior. SpaceX must swiftly and explicitly separate itself from Elon’s personal brand.

Hold all leadership equally accountable to making SpaceX a great place to work for everyone. Apply a critical eye to issues that prevent employees from fully performing their jobs and meeting their potential, pursuing specific and enduring actions that are well resourced, transparent, and treated with the same rigor and urgency as establishing flight rationale after a hardware anomaly.

Define and uniformly respond to all forms of unacceptable behavior. Clearly define what exactly is intended by SpaceX’s “no-asshole” and “zero tolerance” policies and enforce them consistently. SpaceX must establish safe avenues for reporting and uphold clear repercussions for all unacceptable behavior, whether from the CEO or an employee starting their first day.

We care deeply about SpaceX’s mission to make humanity multiplanetary. But more importantly, we care about each other. The collaboration we need to make life multiplanetary is incompatible with a culture that treats employees as consumable resources. Our unique position requires us to consider how our actions today will shape the experiences of individuals beyond our planet. Is the culture we are fostering now the one which we aim to bring to Mars and beyond?

We have made strides in that direction, but there is so much more to accomplish.

Re: SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking Elon Musk

#497

To those arguing that this letter is tantamount to insubordination and is therefore a fireable offense: “Insubordination (noun)- refusing to obey orders from someone in authority.” [1] Unless they had received direct orders not to criticize Musk at all, internally or externally, they are not guilty of refusing to obey orders. And if they had received such orders, that only adds to Musk’s burgeoning reputation for pet…

Even so, they're not protected against being fired -- circulating an internal letter criticizing leadership is, in a right to work state without existing workplace union agreements and outside of a whistleblower or other protected situation, enough to get you fired, though not fired for cause. Are the optics bad? Yes. Is it indicative that "free speech absolutist" Musk believes your right to speech ends where his feelings get hurt? Certainly! But there isn't much the employees can do other than claim unemployment and then bring their talents to a competitor.

Re: SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking Elon Musk

#500
I've owned TSLA stock for over a decade, and I believe in the company, but I find Musk increasingly distasteful. If I had sold the last time it was over $1,000... of course that's the silly wishful thinking we all do in a contraction/correction, but goddamn, I want him out of my life.

I've already sold some of it, just to assuage my conscience a little (as well as lock in some of my profits). The next good opportunity to get out, I will, regardless of my belief that the company could well be worth $2,000 a share. It's just not worth being associated with such a terrible human being.

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