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A religious sect landed Google in a lawsuit

nytimes.com

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Re: A religious sect landed Google in a lawsuit

#111
post #107
post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

TVCs are W-2 employees of a company, with the relevant taxes paid and benefits present.

Of "a" company but not Google. It's unclear how the benefits of Google and the other company compare. I'd guess not well.

Probably not, but there's no legal issue with a W2 employer directing you to work on the campus of another company whose own employees have better benefits.

Re: A religious sect landed Google in a lawsuit

#112
post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Changing the URL to a paywalled article no one can read isn't very helpful though.

Not to be picky, but everyone can read the article. They just have to pay. We have to support journalism some how.

I read it with NoScript blocking Javascript.

Re: A religious sect landed Google in a lawsuit

#113
post #81
post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Had a similar experience. The recruiting part of the process went pretty smoothly, until I got to the onsite. Had 5 on-site interviews (excluding lunch), all exactly the same format: walk in the room where my interviewer is waiting with a question written on the white board, they say "hello" to me and I'm expected to read the question, clarify it a little bit and start coding. Not a single interviewer cared about my…

(Googler, my opinions are my own, etc) When interviewing we are instructed to write up the interview question and answer and score on a rubric with citations into the interview notes. These notes then go to the hiring committee who makes the decision without knowing the human side at all. I think the point is something like this https://www.theguardian.com/women-in-leadership/2013/oct/14/... where the hiring committe…

that reasoning is understandable actually. Given Google's success, maybe this is the right way of approaching the hiring process over the long term at the scale of tens of thousands of employees. However, that kind of culture is just not for me. I ended up getting hired at a small startup working on cutting edge technology and have really enjoyed my time here. So in a way, it turned out well for both me and Google.

Re: A religious sect landed Google in a lawsuit

#114
post #87
post #85

This is just one example of a much bigger issue, which is religious institutions quietly taking over secular businesses without anyone realizing it. It is so pervasive and so stealthy that it is hard to even talk about it without sounding like a crackpot. It has become a little more evident recently with the emergence of evangelical Christian activism in politics, but it runs much, much deeper than that. The LDS Chur…

Weren't the Boy Scouts of America (BSA) up until recently owned by the LDS?

No, the LDS never owned BSA. However they were the largest sponsor of BSA for about a century, until a few years ago.

Re: A religious sect landed Google in a lawsuit

#115
Setting aside the issue of cults, recruiting from church networks is fairly common. It's not surprising and often not nefarious. After all, a church is just another social setting. People also recruit from other non-professional networks -- adult sports leagues, hobbies, alumni networks, family friends, and so on. Churches are just another social group.

I am, however, surprised more companies don't have explicit HR conflict of interest clauses regarding religious entities. Not whole religions, but specific congregations/parishes/etc. Allowing these social networks as unchecked recruiting channels without some sort of control seems like asking for discrimination suits, even when the subject is a traditional religious organization rather than a cult.

I think about religion the same way I think about family. There's nothing wrong with referring your cousin or fellow congregant for a position, but a judicious company should probably flag the conflict of interest in the actual hiring process and perhaps also in management relationships. Otherwise you can end up with centers of influence in the company revolving around an external religious social network, which is a huge risk for the company.

(Alumni networks have the same issue in terms of institutional political dysfunction, but with the important difference that a company cannot be sued for preferring Stanford grads in promotions.)

Re: A religious sect landed Google in a lawsuit

#117
post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Weren't the Boy Scouts of America (BSA) up until recently owned by the LDS?

No, the LDS never owned BSA. However they were the largest sponsor of BSA for about a century, until a few years ago.

Ah. I knew they were integrated somehow.

Re: A religious sect landed Google in a lawsuit

#118
post #85

This is just one example of a much bigger issue, which is religious institutions quietly taking over secular businesses without anyone realizing it. It is so pervasive and so stealthy that it is hard to even talk about it without sounding like a crackpot. It has become a little more evident recently with the emergence of evangelical Christian activism in politics, but it runs much, much deeper than that. The LDS Chur…

> It is so pervasive and so stealthy that it is hard to even talk about it without sounding like a crackpot You're sitting in the intersection of 'it's pervasive', 'nobody is noticing it', and not listing the evidence for it. So yeah, it sounds crackpotty. > It has become a little more evident recently with the emergence of evangelical Christian activism in politics Christians, evangelical or otherwise, have been gen…

Yep, I get that. I did give two examples, but no supporting evidence. In the case of Menlo Park being owned by the Presbyterian Church, I'm not sure how I would support that short of pulling up dozens of Menlo Park property records. I don't know of any journalism about this.

With regards to the LDS church, this is well-known and well-documented. Here's just one easily-found link:

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/photo-essays/2012-07-12/the-m...

Here are some links about the more general problem:

https://www.businessinsider.com/18-extremely-religious-big-a...

https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2017/01/religion-bigger-busin...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientology_as_a_business

Re: A religious sect landed Google in a lawsuit

#119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you read the article, the cult's also been involved in what's arguably sex trafficking. The author wasn't personally harmed in a significant way but I don't see how that's relevant.

Why sue if you haven't been harmed? "I was fired from my team there in February of 2021 because I raised alarm about a cult within Google, a group called the Fellowship of Friends. " Sounds to me like he freaked out because he was working with weirdos, wanted 'someone to do something about it', and then wouldn't let it go.

But he was harmed: he was allegedly fired for reporting religious discrimination.

He may not have been harmed by the cult members, but he was (again, allegedly) harmed by the culture created by this cult. "I learned of someone being discriminated due to their religious beliefs (or lack of), I reported it and the company fired me" makes a good case for the company supporting and/or engaging in religious discrimination.

I'm not saying the author will win - it is entirely possible, like you say, that he was fired for being disruptive or other hundred valid reasons. But I do think the author raises at least a good initial argument.

Re: A religious sect landed Google in a lawsuit

#120
post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please do not take HN threads into religious flamewar. This is a classic generic flamewar tangent, exactly the sort of thing the site guidelines ask you not to do here. If you'd please review them and stick to the rules, we'd appreciate it. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html Edit: you've been posting unsubstantive and/or flamebait comments to other threads to. Could you please stop? We ban accounts that…

Caste discrimination is definitely a thing. HN has had numerous articles about this. https://www.google.com/search?q=site%3Anews.ycombinator.com+... reports 2400 links, since algolia is down for maintenance. https://www.reuters.com/article/us-cisco-lawsuit/california-... is one of the bigger articles about Caste-based discrimination. Google also cancelled a talk over this topic as well. https://www.washingtonpost.com…

Of course it's a thing. As you pointed out, HN has had tons of discussion about it: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31600149.

That has nothing to do with the GP comment being religious flamebait and therefore against the site guidelines, which it obviously was.

I understand the internet forum instinct to look for specialized nefarious secret reasons when a standard moderation decision gets made, but really.

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