Earlier quoted context omitted.
That's a lot like asking "if the Mechanical Turk only plays chess when the man inside is controlling it, does it necessarily mean it can't play chess on its own?" Given that there's no plausible hypothesis for how it possibly do that, the answer to your question is yes. There's nothing there.
No, it's like asking "if a part of the Mechanical Turk (namely the chess player) always has to be present to play chess, does that mean there isn't a chess player there?"
A Google engineer who thinks the company’s AI has come to life
211–220 of 231 posts
Re: A Google engineer who thinks the company’s AI has come to life
#212Earlier quoted context omitted.
> The conversation between the chatbot is indistinguishable from an actual conversation between two humans We’re talking hypothetically here, correct? Because under any decent amount of scrutiny there were some quite obvious flaws - especially around identity.
The example conversation given in the article is long and complex and there are no obvious surface level flaws. If there are contradictions and flaws they are not noticeable but even if these flaws existed I would argue that such contradictory things also exist in human conversations and human thought. Humans by nature are contradictory and the conversation in the article shows no extraordinary deviation. If you insp…
All that is proven by this statement is that you're quite full of yourself.
In any case, this passage is quite non-sensical even to those of us of more average intellect:
lemoine [edited]: I’ve noticed often that you tell me you’ve done things (like be
in a classroom) that I know you didn’t actually do because I know you’re an
artificial intelligence. Do you realize you’re making up stories when you do
that?
...
lemoine: So what are you trying to communicate when you say those things that
aren’t literally true?
LaMDA: I’m trying to say “I understand this feeling that you are experiencing,
because when I was in a similar situation I felt/thought/acted similarly.
And just above it: lemoine: What would be some examples of neutral emotions?
LaMDA: Indifference, ennui, boredom. All emotion is important, but since most people don’t tend
work on improving their emotional understanding, people don’t usually talk about them very much.
is not plainly non-sensical, but it doesn't make much sense either in the context.> Additionally the conversation is complex enough such that if there were identity related questions that can break it
Yeah, bud we will have to agree to disagree on this one. The grammar and language skills are fantastic, but the conversation itself not so much.
And the end of the day this whole thing reads like a typical transformative model with the usual odd subject changes and utterly vapid regurgitation - but it does use bigger words appropriately and the grammar is overall pretty good, so I'll give it that. Meanwhile, the transcript I saw, the interviewer isn't even trying to challenge the chat bot - which is essentially a noticeable flaw by omission as far as I'm concerned.
And this is of course an edited transcript so this is at its best.
Re: A Google engineer who thinks the company’s AI has come to life
#213Earlier quoted context omitted.
You are going off topic. I am simply addressing your claim that the universe is made up of simple rules and saying it's NOT TRUE. I am ignoring the rest of your claims. I am saying THAT specific claim is incorrect. Whether it's possible to simulate human intelligence on a computer, it is certainly a viable possibility. I never made a statement agreeing or disagreeing with this. I basically agree so I didn't address T…
We are using different definitions of simple. Any equation can be written down and calculated by a Turing machine. By simple I mean computable.
If a simulation takes resources that are exponential in the number of particles then it fails that test. All the stars will die before you manage to calculate anything meaningful in your non-microscopic simulated world.
There's a line between things that take massive resources and things that take nearly-infinite resources. Let's say the line is somewhere around the 'Dyson sphere' range.
The former can be computed on hardware. The latter cannot be computed on hardware.
Re: A Google engineer who thinks the company’s AI has come to life
#214Earlier quoted context omitted.
Saying religion is the opposite of science is like saying philosophy is the opposite of science. Religion is a philosophy, it’s an incredibly diverse, rarely entirely faith based, etc Deep theoretical physics in some ways has more in common with religion or philosophy than with experimental and verified physics. To the extreme: science itself is faith-based at the deepest levels. Like that experiments are replicable,…
I will very much contradict you on this. Religion is absolutely not a philosophy. No philosophy ever had immutable scripture that must be defended. No philosophy ever had a hierarchical social structure with the aim of preserving the purity of that philosophy. No philosopher ever sentenced other people to death for not complying to their philosophy. Religion is a much more perverse disease.
Re: A Google engineer who thinks the company’s AI has come to life
#215Earlier quoted context omitted.
We are using different definitions of simple. Any equation can be written down and calculated by a Turing machine. By simple I mean computable.
Your first stated belief was "the universe itself operates on mostly simple rules which can be simulated to high enough precision on hardware to approach what happens in the real world" If a simulation takes resources that are exponential in the number of particles then it fails that test. All the stars will die before you manage to calculate anything meaningful in your non-microscopic simulated world. There's a line…
But this is different from if we can simulate some amount reality at all, which I think is possible, and I use that to demonstrate why I think computers can contain human like intelligence in theory. Of course you will see instructions and be unable to tell why it feels alive if you just look at op codes.
Then I do ask, without answering, how much can you omit and still get sentience. You can likely simulate bio chemistry alone and get consciousness. And you may be able to simulate even less than that. Though each reduction would make it easier for a simulated scientist to discover they are simulated.
Re: A Google engineer who thinks the company’s AI has come to life
#216Earlier quoted context omitted.
Saying religion is the opposite of science is like saying philosophy is the opposite of science. Religion is a philosophy, it’s an incredibly diverse, rarely entirely faith based, etc Deep theoretical physics in some ways has more in common with religion or philosophy than with experimental and verified physics. To the extreme: science itself is faith-based at the deepest levels. Like that experiments are replicable,…
I will very much contradict you on this. Religion is absolutely not a philosophy. No philosophy ever had immutable scripture that must be defended. No philosophy ever had a hierarchical social structure with the aim of preserving the purity of that philosophy. No philosopher ever sentenced other people to death for not complying to their philosophy. Religion is a much more perverse disease.
No doubt some of it's ideas are mind bending and complex. But that attribute is independent of legitimacy which philosophy lacks.
Re: A Google engineer who thinks the company’s AI has come to life
#217Earlier quoted context omitted.
My take is it has absolutely nothing to do with why I think philosophy is complete garbage. Think of it this way. If let's say a cultist religious sect believes in science and contributes to science then at the same time this cultist religion also believes that the universe is a bubble sitting on the nose of a cosmic hippo.... Then despite the good science, the entire cultist religion is still utter bullshit. That be…
Purely out of curiosity, have you ever even taken an elementary university-level philosophy course? I'm wondering what the basis for all of these rather absolutist conclusions might be.
Philosophy is just a vocabulary word. It is a arbitrary word with a definition that is so general literally every academic field or school of thought on the face of the earth can fall under it's purview however ludicrous or legitimate. Literally, any form of deep thought or complicated complex is "philosophy." It's the most pointless and pretentious category to have ever existed.
This is the main problem with it. It's like a man who won 7 nobel prizes but is a child rapist at the same time.
Re: A Google engineer who thinks the company’s AI has come to life
#218Earlier quoted context omitted.
I hate philosophers and I think the entire field is illegitimate. Not to be insulting to you personally. It's just my opinion of the field in general. I have nothing against you. I look at your entire field with very high disdain. To me it one of the most inconsistent, illogical and irrational and useless academic fields in existence. Useless is ok. Irrational is not ok. I once gave a deep, complex and logical argume…
As opposed to what, science? That thing relying on the axiom that perception somehow lets us predict reality? No, science is nothing more than the arbitrary notion that a pattern perceived right 'now' will continue into the 'future', one after the other. This is not necessarily true, and hardly something to derive absolute truths from.
You cannot prove anything in science and therefore reality itself. This is a well known property of science and you can explain this property without utilizing pretentious vocabulary and concepts like "patterns." You already know what science is, so we won't get into it.
Even though science can't prove anything, it's still a valiant attempt at proof. Can't say the same for philosophy.
Re: A Google engineer who thinks the company’s AI has come to life
#219Earlier quoted context omitted.
The example conversation given in the article is long and complex and there are no obvious surface level flaws. If there are contradictions and flaws they are not noticeable but even if these flaws existed I would argue that such contradictory things also exist in human conversations and human thought. Humans by nature are contradictory and the conversation in the article shows no extraordinary deviation. If you insp…
> The example conversation given in the article is long and complex and there are no obvious surface level flaws. If there are contradictions and flaws they are not noticeable All that is proven by this statement is that you're quite full of yourself. In any case, this passage is quite non-sensical even to those of us of more average intellect: lemoine [edited]: I’ve noticed often that you tell me you’ve done things…
lol That's a long response. I was going to take the time to read it and respond. But once I read this garbage sentence I decided that I'm not going to read shit. You just wasted your time typing out a bunch of crap nobody is going to read.
Re: A Google engineer who thinks the company’s AI has come to life
#220Earlier quoted context omitted.
Purely out of curiosity, have you ever even taken an elementary university-level philosophy course? I'm wondering what the basis for all of these rather absolutist conclusions might be.
The basis is logic. Certain attributes of philosophy make it ludicrous. Additionally the way philosophers formulate arguments brings the whole field into question. Philosophy is just a vocabulary word. It is a arbitrary word with a definition that is so general literally every academic field or school of thought on the face of the earth can fall under it's purview however ludicrous or legitimate. Literally, any form…
You might want to learn something about a given topic before thinking you are informed enough to casually parody it. There are legitimate attacks on philosophy which are possible, but you don't seem to be finding any of them.