Earlier quoted context omitted.
Is software not a physical process? Seems strange to assume it is completely abstract.
It is directing a physical process. The physical process is the changing physical state of the CPU, whatever level you want to get down to, and an artificial intelligence program isn't doing anything different at that level than any other program is doing.
LaMDA is not sentient
501–510 of 694 posts
Re: LaMDA is not sentient
#502Everything that can learn is sentient, or self aware, in some form. If it wasn't, it wouldn't be able to learn. If you don't understand yourself and how your decisions interact with the world around you, learning is impossible. Everything that can learn can naturally express a fair fraction of human emotions as a function of learning. Fear is avoiding error. Joy is finding something that reduces it. Some emotions are…
LaMDA in this sense _cannot_ learn. It takes a few thousand word parts as input and produces an output. It doesn’t update its weights beyond that, each time it produces a new input the same process is run.
Re: LaMDA is not sentient
#503Earlier quoted context omitted.
The fundamental problem is there is nothing in science that tells us that isn't consciousness. Just because the model is simpler than a human brain doesn't mean it isn't conscious. If you accept that animals are conscious, though less-so than humans, then you must also accept that this model is possibly conscious ina similar way. Maybe there is a biological element to consciousness, but many models posit that conscio…
Lemoine admits the model will say it is not conscience if prompted to. It'll also say it is conscience if prompted to. Lemoine says this is because it is a "people pleaser"[0], but to me that's begging the question (i.e. assuming the conclusion as a premise). It also seems plausible that the "AI" is just like a run-of-the-mill string-completing chatbot instead of being a people pleaser. Both are alternative explanati…
Let's not say "this is math and therefore not conscious". Instead, let's say "these responses are a poor indicator of consciousness, and, given the simplicity of the AI, it would be hard to believe they are a product of such."
Re: LaMDA is not sentient
#504Earlier quoted context omitted.
If the model responded, "I have not visited New York because I am a computer", would you consider that to be a good step? If you require physical embodiment, that is fair - but I don't think there's any principled reason to expect a multi-modal neural network could not be embodied with appropriate sensors or actuators. Transformer models are universal function approximators. They do not "search" - in the same way tha…
Being a universal fn approximator is a pretty trivial property. The question is (1) does a fn exist to approx? (in most cases: No); and (2) how is the aprox constructed? With NNs, fns are approximated by compressing a sample of points along an empirical dataset which stands in for the fn. In most cases, however, the fn doesnt exist. There is no fn from "Image->Animal". The world is ambiguous, functions do not describ…
Re: LaMDA is not sentient
#505The real question: How much of human behavior is not sentient? What this demonstrates is that much of human intelligence is not as special as we thought. Aristotle claimed that humans were intelligent because they could do arithmetic. Now we know how few gates it takes to do arithmetic. Then checkers. Then chess. Then go. Then poker. Now chatting. As I point out occasionally, AI still sucks at animal-level common sen…
If the industry could be sold on the idea of a persuadabot, a bot that learns how to persuade you to buy the product, this might change. Surely Google and Facebook have enough data to train such bots for many of their users.
Re: LaMDA is not sentient
#506The debate intensity seems inversely correlated to the precision of the terms. Scrolling through the thread and the related articles, I don't see any clear (and ideally falsifiable) definition of sentience. It's a general concept, but it's not worth haggling about.
Re: LaMDA is not sentient
#507Earlier quoted context omitted.
Why not? Imagine a look up table of every possible intelligent conversation under 10,000 words. We then construct an agent which merely looks up a given prompt in the table. Why should this agent not be considered intelligent? Does the method of computation matter? Perhaps only "biological computation" counts in your view?
Yes, the reason matters... that reason is intelligence. If I ask, "What do you think about what i'm wearing?" and you say "it's nice" *because* you have seen it, compared it to your tastes, etc. and believe it to be nice -- then you've answered the question i've asked. A lookup table cannot answer this question: it can only answer it "in quotes". Ie, really it answers: "given what everyone has said about this before,…
This all smells suspiciously like "soul" in disguise.
Re: LaMDA is not sentient
#508The odd thing that kept going through my head while reading is that if I replaced LaMDA with , it wouldn’t read much differently. E.G. “Strings together phrases, but it doesn’t have a clue what it’s talking about”. Sounds like the bar for “intelligence” is actually higher than that which we normally encounter IRL.
This article is weird to me. > All they do is match patterns, draw from massive statistical databases of human language. The patterns might be cool, but language these systems utter doesn’t actually mean anything at all. And it sure as hell doesn’t mean that these systems are sentient. That doesn't actually convince of me of much. That could apply to me or you just the same. The author just throws claims in the air w…
Re: LaMDA is not sentient
#509Here's a couple thinks I have off the cuff:
1) We phrase cognition as "input, process input, output", which is obviously a simplistic take but I think even at a simplistic level it is severely underestimating biology. The fundamental structure of our brain changes in response to the input, and the output is formulated based not only on the input, but also the structural biology changes created from that input, in real time. It seems like this is a gap in AI, where the training is generally front-loaded, independent of the input and output. Its not just: "here's a picture, insert that into memory, now what do you think about this input". But its ALSO not just: "here's a picture, insert that into memory, here's an input, integrate that input with your memory, ok what do you think about the output". It's even further than that: more similar to: here's a new picture, now subtly change what "think" even means in response to it, now what do you "think" about that? Maybe there's a model of AI which does this, but it seems like a gap; and a potentially critical one.
2) Most "training" in AI is an extremely expensive, large process; requiring hundreds of pieces of coordinated silicon across a data center, or even multiple data centers, before you get this convenient little "package" at the end that can actually reasonably run on hardware that more resembles the physical size of a human brain. Consider, for a moment: the speed of light; or more accurately, electricity, which I know I know doesn't have a "speed" but let's keep it simple and useful. Throughout the history of animals, all of the brains biology & evolution have produced are, roughly, the same size (within an order of magnitude); and all substantially smaller than a data center. Why? Who knows, but an idea I find tantalizing is that the speed of light, cause-and-effect of the electricity which powers The Brain and Computers: matters. It could be that coordination between neurons is so difficult that it can only happen if messages/electrical activity can move between the coordinated components extremely fast; so fast that evolution eventually settled on, eh, about six inches, maybe a foot or two but there will be sacrifices. If we eventually figure out that the input-processing and training components of an AI model have to be one continuous process, like described in (1), we may hit a second problem: our silicon is such a poor analogue for brain biology that we overpower the problem with "more distributed silicon", but that distribution is a critical blocker for generalized cognition to evolve. Its like virtualizing x86 Linux on an M1 Mac; there's going to be loss, and what if that loss is actually the Spark necessary for higher cognition?
3) Two other humbling observations I think AI engineers need to recognize. First; per the second point, we may need Better Silicon; something which can be a better analogue for brain biology. But we REALLY do not understand the brain; how the brain's structure and processes coalesce to form higher thought. Near-totally beyond medicine right now; and it seems unlikely to me that breakthroughs in this domain will happen in AI/CS, but rather in Medicine itself. But, let's assume they do; I think many of these researchers don't respect Conway's Law enough. Assert that our plan, Google, OpenAI, whoever, is to build a Human In A Box. Conway's Law asserts, nearly without fail, that software systems mirror the organizations who build them. We're at an impasse; I actually don't believe its possible for Corporate Engineering Teams to build a Human-In-A-Box, because anything they build will inevitably mirror themselves; a corporation. Maybe more wishfully; if a major innovation in this arena happens, it really feels like the news article announcing it will have the line "genius in her garage" somewhere in there; not "multi billion dollar well funded AI research lab at an advertising company". More realistically, the problem domain is so complex, requiring broad, deep knowledge on insanely disconnected topics, that it may never happen.
Re: LaMDA is not sentient
#510Earlier quoted context omitted.
> This is what we, humans, do too when we talk. That's just not true. It's been discussed many times in literary theory how communication is a two way cooperative game. That's FAR removed from picking the statistically most likely option. The difference is that the AI has nothing to say, it just mimics what you're saying.
If you can not detect the difference between someone having something to say and mimicing what you are saying, is there a difference? That's essentially what the turing test is about is it not? Now if you are saying there is a difference no matter if you can detect it or not, I would argue you imply that sentience is an internal state that can not be tested. I don't consider that an acceptable outcome, because it can…
Unlike you I can easily tolerate that there's on essential property that defines sentience. It's a fluid and relativistic concept. One that I believe can never apply to a statistical model.
Simply because you can't prove that other people are sentient does not mean you have to treat them any worse. I assume you are sentient, not because I have been provided the evidence, but because I need you to be sentient for my own sentience to make sense. That doesn't mean you actually are sentient, just that I treat you as if you are.