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Temporary pause of Bitcoin withdrawals on Binance

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Re: Temporary pause of Bitcoin withdrawals on Binance

#381

Post by karpierz »

eatsyourtacos wrote: post #341
twawaaay wrote: post #266

I am so happy about this. I hope this is going to sour crypto for "investors". I use quotes, because they really are not -- investing should be reserved for fronting cash to create some value (like buying stock to infuse capital into a corporation). As it is all crypto trading is purely speculation. The world would be so much better if money tended to be exchanged in good faith, to improve something rather than just…

>investing should be reserved for fronting cash to create some value (like buying stock to infuse capital into a corporation). As it is all crypto trading is purely speculation. Ok but let's be real- buying a stock is not really "creating value". The stock already exists. Company A has issued 100 shares. People are buying/selling it in the market.. no one is creating value there. Sure they may be arbitrarily driving…

> Ok but let's be real- buying a stock is not really "creating value". The stock already exists. Company A has issued 100 shares. People are buying/selling it in the market.. no one is creating value there. Sure they may be arbitrarily driving the value up, but that's not creating real value.

If it wasn't possible to resell stocks, capital acquired via stock issuance would be much more expensive. The stock market allows stocks to function as a means of seeding capital.

It's like saying "paying back your mortgage doesn't get buy you a house." The mortgage only exists because it gets paid back.

> Also, I would say the people sitting here buying and selling stocks are most of the time 99% pure speculation. They have zero control over what actually happens in the company. Sure they can do "research" and guess what might happen.. but it's still nearly all gambling.

Yes, which general advice is to spread your capital across the whole market. It used to be that you had to spend your capital building up your own business, which is even worse than trying to pick your own stocks. Now you can diversify your risk world-wide, as to avoid any sort of local calamities.

Re: Temporary pause of Bitcoin withdrawals on Binance

#382

Post by Consultant32452 »

achenet wrote: post #376
vkou wrote: post #368

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Crypto needed a tangible market/reason d'etre to be valuable. The reason, as we have been reminded so many times, is that it's an inflation-resistant store of value. Pay no attention to BTC tanking right after actual inflation started. It's weird how, as an inflation-resistant store of value, it only seems to work when we have asset-inflation, but stops working when we have main-street-grocery-prices-inflation. Per…

no, it's to buy drugs on the internet.

Both are very important functions for a currency or store of value.

Re: Temporary pause of Bitcoin withdrawals on Binance

#383

Post by 7steps2much »

hectorlorenzo wrote: post #319
m348e912 wrote: post #270

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have two buying/selling indicators for crypto. 1. When my mom or other people who have no business in investing in crypto ask me how much bitcoin they should buy. (selling indicator) 2. When people start liquidating their positions and call crypto a grift. (buying indicator)

What do you do when both are happening at the same time?

Develop split personality disorder and begin trading with yourself

Re: Temporary pause of Bitcoin withdrawals on Binance

#384

Post by twawaaay »

dubswithus wrote: post #362
twawaaay wrote: post #266

I am so happy about this. I hope this is going to sour crypto for "investors". I use quotes, because they really are not -- investing should be reserved for fronting cash to create some value (like buying stock to infuse capital into a corporation). As it is all crypto trading is purely speculation. The world would be so much better if money tended to be exchanged in good faith, to improve something rather than just…

Being happy about retail investors losing money is immoral. I hope you realize that. We have a lot of investments in the US that do nothing except force people to grind even harder. Look at the housing market. Why should housing be an investment when we absolutely need it to live and there are other investment vehicles that do just as well if not better?

> Being happy about retail investors losing money is immoral. I hope you realize that.

No, it is not immoral. Retail "investors" should know better than "invest" into things with very shaky connection to reality where it is predicted value next Wednesday can be anywhere between zero and infinity. If they loose all your money on crypto that is purely their fault for "investing" into something which has no real value and can loose its virtual value in no time.

They wanted their chance at huge profits on an extremely volatile market and extreme volatility is what they got.

Re: Temporary pause of Bitcoin withdrawals on Binance

#385

Post by Consultant32452 »

nradov wrote: post #340
0daystock wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All monetary systems are built on trust. You can say the same thing about a run on traditional banks, which only have a fraction of reserves to cover deposits and would result in similar price depression.

False. Fiat monetary systems are built on a state monopoly on violence. Trust is merely a byproduct. You are required to pay taxes in the local fiat currency, and if you fail to pay then the government will eventually seize your assets by force, or perhaps put you in jail. This is a feature, not a bug, and it generally works fairly well in practice as long as the government is at least minimally competent.

"generally works fairly well" - I agree with this, but I doubt we would agree at what it does fairly well. In the fiat systems the people with the most coins can issue themselves more coins on a whim, thereby devaluing all the other coins held by the poor. This too is a feature, not a bug, and it works really well for all the people with the most coins. They get to slowly and consistently extract wealth from the poor without having to do any work.

Re: Temporary pause of Bitcoin withdrawals on Binance

#386

Post by gardenhedge »

jmoak3 wrote: post #20

You really cannot make this up. As usual crypto in practice is the opposite of decentralized because people. Will. Not. Run. Their. Servers. Moxie nailed it

Can you explain your comment a bit more? How does Binances' actions affect Bitcoin users who don't use Binance? And how do you arrive at your comment from this tweet? It doesn't say or imply how many people are using Binance.

Futhermore, people who use Binance might also use a number of other options.

Re: Temporary pause of Bitcoin withdrawals on Binance

#387

Post by twawaaay »

eatsyourtacos wrote: post #341
twawaaay wrote: post #266

I am so happy about this. I hope this is going to sour crypto for "investors". I use quotes, because they really are not -- investing should be reserved for fronting cash to create some value (like buying stock to infuse capital into a corporation). As it is all crypto trading is purely speculation. The world would be so much better if money tended to be exchanged in good faith, to improve something rather than just…

>investing should be reserved for fronting cash to create some value (like buying stock to infuse capital into a corporation). As it is all crypto trading is purely speculation. Ok but let's be real- buying a stock is not really "creating value". The stock already exists. Company A has issued 100 shares. People are buying/selling it in the market.. no one is creating value there. Sure they may be arbitrarily driving…

The difference between speculation and investing isn't in that you want to earn money (everybody who buys stock want to increase their wealth). The reason is for why you pick this particular instrument.

When I buy stock (or when Berkshire Hathaway does it) I buy into business that I hope has sound fundaments and is going to grow and create more value over time. I spend considerable effort trying to understand the situation the business is in, do they have dangers ahead of them, do they have sound leadership, etc. This is investing -- buying things that you hope are going to increase in value over long time.

Speculation is when you buy things for reasons that are not at all connected with the thing you are buying. For example you noticed people are buying crypto, the price is going up, so why not jump in on the wagon and get your cut of the profit. This is speculation because it totally ignores what is it that you are buying, and the only thing that you care is that the price is going up.

Re: Temporary pause of Bitcoin withdrawals on Binance

#388

Post by Geee »

lolc wrote: post #372
Geee wrote: post #315

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a common fallacy. Hoarding, saving, preparing for the future is one of most fundamental human needs and the bedrock for a functioning economy and society. There's no fundamental economic principle which would indicate that an inflationary money would do any good to a society. It destroys savings, which is opposite of what is good for an individual and a society. Also, because you mentioned colonialism, read th…

Money isn't wealth. What you can get for it is. Hoarding casino chips does not prepare you for the future. It just makes the people running the casino richer with goods you traded for the chips. Oh you say, I can trade the chips with other people. Also the chips are numbered and we have an agreement to never accept a casino chip numbered over 1 trillion. Then we pay the casino one chip every time we trade. So the cas…

Money allows optionality - instead of hoarding food and fuel, you can hoard money and buy the things you need in the future. If you know for sure that you need food and fuel, and hoard them in advance, they will rot and evaporate by the time you need them.

Inflationary money is like rotting food, instead of canned food. It makes no sense at all to store your wealth in rotting and evaporating things.

Re: Temporary pause of Bitcoin withdrawals on Binance

#389

Post by 1270018080 »

can16358p wrote: post #295
1270018080 wrote: post #263

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As long as people want to buy illegal things online, I don't think bitcoin will go to zero. That has, and always will be, it's only rational use case.

Wow. I just learned that all the toyally legit things I've done with Bitcoin are all illegal.

By rational, I mean the only time it is better than other methods. Buying legal things with bitcoin is slower, more expensive, dramatically more environmentally harmful, and dangerous to the consumer (no regulation). Truly no upside in real life applications unless you're trying to do illegal things.

Re: Temporary pause of Bitcoin withdrawals on Binance

#390

Post by saalweachter »

ericmay wrote: post #377
saalweachter wrote: post #374

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Maybe the issue is just that we no longer have a store of wealth that isn't tied to a speculative asset? You say speculative, I say productive. Is a non-productive store of value actually a thing which exists in nature? For most things, you can't store a thing itself: grain rots, chickens die, houses decay, iron rusts, water is fouled. If you want to have a thing in the future, you need a way to produce the thing:…

> You say speculative, I say productive. Oh I totally agree! Stocks in companies are absolutely productive assets. Though they are still speculative. I guess the first thought that comes to mind is well, so what? Does it make sense for individuals to plow money into the stock market even at all-time highs? Should you basically have to perform an investor level due diligence for buying these productive assets? Sometim…

Gold famously doesn't decay, but why should I expect prices to remain constant in terms of gold? If I sell you a chicken today for 80 milligrams of gold, why would you be obligated to sell me an equivalent chicken for 80 milligrams of gold in twenty years?

Gold isn't a perfect store or value, it's just a perfect store of gold.

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