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Apple and Google’s mobile browser ‘stranglehold’ may face UK investigation

theguardian.com

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Re: Apple and Google’s mobile browser ‘stranglehold’ may face UK investigation

#11

Post by capableweb »

beardyw wrote: post #3

I am struggling to get my arms round this I mean, it's not actually about the browser, but let's ignore that. Companies that sell phones choose to install a particular OS. Apple's choice is obvious, for others (99.9%) it's a version of Android. The vast majority of those choose to use Google's ecosystem with its Playstore. Much as I can understand the sentiment, I can't see how it equates to a stranglehold. If others…

On iOS, it is about the browser, as Apple is acting anti-competitive by not allowing any other browser engines but their own. Browser makers can't compete with Safari by making a faster browser for example, because they won't be able to deploy it on iOS device. All applications go through the App Store, and the App Store forbids any browser engines not made by Apple.

Regarding the app stores, it seems like lawmakers are catching up with the idea of "If I buy it, I should be able to own it and make my own decisions", which includes being able to install applications from 3rd party developers. It seems like a fine idea that Apple has a default application index where you can install applications from, but what is not fine is Apple deciding which application indexes should be allowed to exists in the first place.

Kind of like how lawmakers wouldn't look the other way if suddenly all macOS computers only allowed installation of software from the App Store. Purchasing a device shouldn't mean "The company decides what I'm allowed to install on this thing".

Re: Apple and Google’s mobile browser ‘stranglehold’ may face UK investigation

#13

Post by Aardwolf »

On Android I can install Firefox, Edge, other versions of these browsers from f-droid, and many other browsers, all with their own engines.

On iPhones, afaik, you can only get Safari, or other browsers that are just a thin wrapper around Safari.

That is a huge difference and I hope they know that.

Re: Apple and Google’s mobile browser ‘stranglehold’ may face UK investigation

#14

Post by hourago »

beardyw wrote: post #3

I am struggling to get my arms round this I mean, it's not actually about the browser, but let's ignore that. Companies that sell phones choose to install a particular OS. Apple's choice is obvious, for others (99.9%) it's a version of Android. The vast majority of those choose to use Google's ecosystem with its Playstore. Much as I can understand the sentiment, I can't see how it equates to a stranglehold. If others…

> If others want to create a new OS and get manufacturers to install it they can.

That is always true for any monopoly. Any company could create their own phone system and compete with AT&T. That was never in doubt. The problem is that it is not happening, there is no competition, and when there is, some FAANG buys it.

Capitalism does not work without competition. Economies of scale and the network effect makes it really difficult to compete. Or governments do something, or stagnation and centralised control take over.

Re: Apple and Google’s mobile browser ‘stranglehold’ may face UK investigation

#15

Post by justincormack »

beardyw wrote: post #3

I am struggling to get my arms round this I mean, it's not actually about the browser, but let's ignore that. Companies that sell phones choose to install a particular OS. Apple's choice is obvious, for others (99.9%) it's a version of Android. The vast majority of those choose to use Google's ecosystem with its Playstore. Much as I can understand the sentiment, I can't see how it equates to a stranglehold. If others…

Competition authorities now look at situations that end up uncompetitive, so in this case there is (perhaps implicit, or they are looking for) evidence that its not easy to launch a new phone platform and OS because of the behaviour of the existing platforms. I think the question they need to answer is whether its due to the behaviour of the uncumbents, or that the cost of making a competitive OS (with maps etc) is very high. You could also argue that Android is "price dumping" as it is cross subsidised via the ad business (as is iOS too as Google pays billions) which makes it more complex from the competition point of view.

Re: Apple and Google’s mobile browser ‘stranglehold’ may face UK investigation

#18

Post by boudin »

Aardwolf wrote: post #13

On Android I can install Firefox, Edge, other versions of these browsers from f-droid, and many other browsers, all with their own engines. On iPhones, afaik, you can only get Safari, or other browsers that are just a thin wrapper around Safari. That is a huge difference and I hope they know that.

It's a bit like IE in the 2000s, it was possible to install an alternative browser on Windows but the fact that IE was pre-installed and set as default meant that it was very hard for competitors to get in the market.

This is a similar situation on Android.

Re: Apple and Google’s mobile browser ‘stranglehold’ may face UK investigation

#20

Post by tgv »

Aardwolf wrote: post #13

On Android I can install Firefox, Edge, other versions of these browsers from f-droid, and many other browsers, all with their own engines. On iPhones, afaik, you can only get Safari, or other browsers that are just a thin wrapper around Safari. That is a huge difference and I hope they know that.

What's wrong with a wrapper around Safari? It's a capable and efficient browser. Firefox can wrap its bookmark sharing and whatever around it (I actually use Firefox on iOS, though I don't bother with the profile sharing). We don't need Safari to be 100% Chrome compatible, right? That's just for lazy programmers and greedy marketeers.
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