Ask HN: Is brogrammer a sexist term? • Hacker News Board

Re: Ask HN: Is brogrammer a sexist term?

#81

Post by CodeMage » Fri, Oct 28, 2011, 2:53 PM UTC

ia wrote: post #69

maybe they are going for cultural fit, first and foremost. if you were offended by this job advert, it's likely you wouldn't be a good fit. why hide company culture by writing a stiff and sterile ad? i'm not saying what they did was good or bad, unless they are actually breaking laws in the post--then it's bad. other than that, if you don't like the way they phrased things, don't apply.

Hey, that's great logic. Remind me to start a company where we have a dedicated "porn-watching hour", too. I'm sure it will make for a spectacular ad and attract a lot of serious talent.

Re: Ask HN: Is brogrammer a sexist term?

#82

Post by twerth » Fri, Oct 28, 2011, 2:53 PM UTC

Sexist? maybe, insensitive? probably, immature and cliche? absolutely.

Re: Ask HN: Is brogrammer a sexist term?

#83

Post by [deleted] » Fri, Oct 28, 2011, 2:54 PM UTC

[deleted]

Re: Ask HN: Is brogrammer a sexist term?

#84

Post by andrewem » Fri, Oct 28, 2011, 2:54 PM UTC

mrspeaker wrote: post #9

I think you could argue that "brogrammer" is gender neutral. I also think that anyone advertising for a "brogrammer", ironically or not, are probably not going to have or attract software engineers who you could learn from.

Using terms in US job ads which you could argue are gender neutral is a great way to be given the opportunity to make that argument to the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission.

Re: Ask HN: Is brogrammer a sexist term?

#85

Post by bzajac » Fri, Oct 28, 2011, 2:55 PM UTC

Cross Reference to a post yesterday: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3162917

The title: "Female FOSS dev quits tech industry due to harassment" and the comments delved into the same issue here.

Re: Ask HN: Is brogrammer a sexist term?

#86

Post by jgrahamc » Fri, Oct 28, 2011, 2:56 PM UTC

mdasen wrote: post #34

Rather than focusing on whether it's sexist or not, I would start by saying that it is unwise. I think that we (as a society) want young people to see all avenues as open to them regardless of gender. I highly doubt that the company doesn't want to hire women or has any sexist intention. However, it is unwise for us (as individuals and an industry) to use terms like "brogrammer" because it subtly suggests gender. One…

And by extension unwise that Y Combinator thought it was an appropriate ad to allow on this site.

Re: Ask HN: Is brogrammer a sexist term?

#87

Post by ia » Fri, Oct 28, 2011, 2:56 PM UTC

mattmanser wrote: post #77

ia wrote: post #69

maybe they are going for cultural fit, first and foremost. if you were offended by this job advert, it's likely you wouldn't be a good fit. why hide company culture by writing a stiff and sterile ad? i'm not saying what they did was good or bad, unless they are actually breaking laws in the post--then it's bad. other than that, if you don't like the way they phrased things, don't apply.

The reason there's a law against it is because bigots that still exist keep women from attaining equality and that's bad, not the other way around. It is in itself bad. You have a strange moral compass to me. I know it's fun to be laddish when you're at college and uni, but cultural fit can often be a polite way of saying 'Hey, I'm a bigot, women are stupid and I'm not employing them above the level of secretary!'. I…

Can you explain your first sentence? I'm not sure what you're trying to say. I'm not defending bigotry/sexism/etc. Hopefully, you didn't take my comment that way.

Re: Ask HN: Is brogrammer a sexist term?

#88

Post by rprime » Fri, Oct 28, 2011, 2:57 PM UTC

ia wrote: post #69

maybe they are going for cultural fit, first and foremost. if you were offended by this job advert, it's likely you wouldn't be a good fit. why hide company culture by writing a stiff and sterile ad? i'm not saying what they did was good or bad, unless they are actually breaking laws in the post--then it's bad. other than that, if you don't like the way they phrased things, don't apply.

Exactly my thoughts, I really like that they actually exposed their cultural thoughts on this one, I hope to see this kind of trend in job postins more and it really makes me want to join that respective company.

On the other hand I don't understand, why, most of you, as males are really getting mad about this? Why do you feel offended? If you have a female programmer friend, ask her about this and make her post their opinions, not you. I'll bet my life savings that all females that are into tech (that I know) will not have the slightest problem with this.

Stop whining about this kind of stuff HN, you're better than this.

Re: Ask HN: Is brogrammer a sexist term?

#89

Post by DanBC » Fri, Oct 28, 2011, 2:57 PM UTC

The job ad is awful. Maybe they do not mean to be discriminatory; but that doesn't matter. Any woman applying for, but not getting, the job can then point to the ad and ask if she was discriminated against because of her sex. The hassle of dealing with that will sap time and resources from actual work.

> You are a native english speaker (our tech relies on speech recognition)

This sentence is also unwise in the UK.

Re: Ask HN: Is brogrammer a sexist term?

#90

Post by dgabriel » Fri, Oct 28, 2011, 2:59 PM UTC

Woman programmer here: I automatically assumed they were looking for college aged men. "Brogrammer," is not a unisex term, no matter how they try to spin it.