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I love the Linux desktop, but that doesn't mean I don't see its problems

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Re: I love the Linux desktop, but that doesn't mean I don't see its problems

#31

Post by Gordonjcp »

MisterBastahrd wrote: post #25

I hate it, which is why I don't use it. Ubuntu got the closest for me, but the owner's refusal to allow users to move that taskbar to the bottom of the screen made me give up on it altogether. And unless it's a supported distro, I don't want it. Been burned too many times by pet projects that end up being abandoned. The other thing is that in all my years of using Windows and MacOS, I have NEVER had an issue where an…

> but the owner's refusal to allow users to move that taskbar to the bottom of the screen

You're going to need to explain that one.

Re: I love the Linux desktop, but that doesn't mean I don't see its problems

#32

Post by squarefoot »

akira2501 wrote: post #12
encryptluks2 wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

More accurate title... I love the Linux desktop, but I just want one version of it so that I don't have to deal with competition and jobs with different tools. In other words, I'll likely switch to Apple.

That, and I don't understand the needless fascination with "crushing windows." That's a goal that seems completely misaligned with all the features that make the linux desktop something I want to use; and destroying competition has never been a great long term strategy. I don't care about your market share.. I care about the quality of my own experience.

> I don't understand the needless fascination with "crushing windows."

That was the common sentiment 20+ years ago when Steve Ballmer, then Microsoft CEO, declared that "Linux is a cancer". Today I'd say it's not the case anymore, especially so since they were forced by market laws to fake some form of friendship with Open Source, not to mention having ruined Windows with all versions from 8 on. Windows is pretty much crushing itself these days.

Re: I love the Linux desktop, but that doesn't mean I don't see its problems

#33

Post by night-rider »

xalava wrote: post #19

As a desktop, Linux is now fully functional for most users. I know administrations running on Linux, law firms, and even my dad. Beginner users don't care about choices, they get Linux Mint or similar with LibreOffice and Firefox and they are good to go for most of their tasks. For advanced users, the abundance is a key benefit of this ecosystem. No company is fully focused on the desktop OS, and I don't see why they…

The thing about Linux is that it’s hackable and you can customise it to your liking. I’ve been using it for about a decade and the only thing it can’t do is run iTunes so I have a virtual machine for Windows stuff. It’s worth having a separate Linux box where you can tinker with new software and customisations without those changes affecting your daily driver OS. I found that over time the more customisations you do the more the OS breaks down and starts to get buggy. Having a dedicated box for tinkering is essential and you can just do a fresh install when you’ve made many irreversible mistakes.

Re: I love the Linux desktop, but that doesn't mean I don't see its problems

#34

Post by user00012-ab »

twblalock wrote: post #18
encryptluks2 wrote: post #10

This article is sort of frustrating, because the issue they have isn't like something not working, just that there are multiple competing options and they want unity around all things.

Yeah but the fragmentation is the problem. One reason Windows and macOS are popular is that people know what they are going to get. If you've used one Windows 11 box, for example, you can get on another Windows 11 box and figure out how to use it. It will have the same user interface and window management as the other: the Start menu, the control panel, the desktop, etc. That's just not the case for Linux. There are…

The problem is there is no decent software that runs on linux; I'd switch from Mac to linux if I could run Ableton, Adobe_products.* or Affinity_products.*

And no, I don't want to hear about the software XYZ that is almost just like any of the above, because they aren't even close.

If I just wanted to browse the web, and work in a terminal, then linux is great.

Re: I love the Linux desktop, but that doesn't mean I don't see its problems

#35

Post by night-rider »

cm2187 wrote: post #23

I get (and hate) the fact that Microsoft is pushing hard for the desktop to become a light client integrated in their cloud, but isn’t apple doing exactly the same? I don’t own a mac but my iphone nags me all the time to use apple’s cloud services for everything and I understand apple is making MacOS converge to iOS. The obstacle to switching to linux for me is not too many distributions, it is that I have to relearn…

Make the time. It’s worth it I promise. The freedom that comes with Linux is astonishing. I’ve been using it for a decade now and haven’t looked back. ‘If you want to move mountains you start by picking up small stones’

Re: I love the Linux desktop, but that doesn't mean I don't see its problems

#36

Post by Gordonjcp »

twblalock wrote: post #18
encryptluks2 wrote: post #10

This article is sort of frustrating, because the issue they have isn't like something not working, just that there are multiple competing options and they want unity around all things.

Yeah but the fragmentation is the problem. One reason Windows and macOS are popular is that people know what they are going to get. If you've used one Windows 11 box, for example, you can get on another Windows 11 box and figure out how to use it. It will have the same user interface and window management as the other: the Start menu, the control panel, the desktop, etc. That's just not the case for Linux. There are…

> Yeah but the fragmentation is the problem.

Yes, exactly. It's the same problem all over, too - look at transport! You shouldn't ride a bike, you should drive a massive V8-powered 4x4 like I do. It meets my needs, so it must meet yours, right?

Re: I love the Linux desktop, but that doesn't mean I don't see its problems

#37

Post by Gordonjcp »

user00012-ab wrote: post #34
twblalock wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah but the fragmentation is the problem. One reason Windows and macOS are popular is that people know what they are going to get. If you've used one Windows 11 box, for example, you can get on another Windows 11 box and figure out how to use it. It will have the same user interface and window management as the other: the Start menu, the control panel, the desktop, etc. That's just not the case for Linux. There are…

The problem is there is no decent software that runs on linux; I'd switch from Mac to linux if I could run Ableton, Adobe_products.* or Affinity_products.* And no, I don't want to hear about the software XYZ that is almost just like any of the above, because they aren't even close. If I just wanted to browse the web, and work in a terminal, then linux is great.

> If I just wanted to browse the web, and work in a terminal, then linux is great.

Or edit video, or make music, or write all the stuff that makes this possible.

Re: I love the Linux desktop, but that doesn't mean I don't see its problems

#39

Post by sushisource »

idle_zealot wrote: post #22

If the Linux desktop consolidates/unifies around one option I’d probably stop using it. The primary reason I use Linux on my desktop is so that I can use my niche window manager of choice as a first-class citizen, rather than hacking reasonable window management into the system with scripts on top of a bad-by-default window manager. If I can’t do that anymore I might as well use macOS with yabai and get the broader a…

I agree that the customization is a huge draw for me.

But... I also want things like hibernate to just work, screen tearing to not happen on X11, etc etc.

The polish is absolutely not there, and I agree w/ the article that's a result of the fragmented ecosystem. If the Linux community could agree to invest in the underlying APIs for desktop stuff, it seems we'd be in a much better place and still have lots of customization options on top.

Of course, I understand that's a huge coordination challenge.

Re: I love the Linux desktop, but that doesn't mean I don't see its problems

#40

Post by jamesgeck0 »

shrimp_emoji wrote: post #27

KDE is the most fully featured Linux DE, and it's leaps and bounds above Windows's (WAY better file manager, better launcher, more features, and even less bugs somehow). The other day, my Windows 10's explorer.exe crashed when the file manager tried to load a directory, which is something that used to happen in Vista and hasn't happened in KDE for years IME.

> even less bugs somehow

This is very far from my experience. I installed OpenSUSE Tumbleweed (recommended as one of the best KDE distros) at the beginning of 2022 and ran into a dozen KDE Plasma bugs within an hour. Stuff like panel widths resizing just because I clicked "customize," or widgets vanishing when I tried to drag them onto panels, or the bluetooth icon vanishing from the status bar until I restarted my session, or even the settings manager freezing up.

The basic desktop worked well enough, but as soon as I started customizing it I ran into all sorts of paper-cut edge-case type bugs.

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