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I quit the tech industry (2015)

eev.ee

191–200 of 276 posts

Re: I quit the tech industry (2015)

#192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Nurses? I know a lot of nurses. They make decent (not outrageous) money, but their work environment is frequently a shitshow. Many are quitting. >Tenured professors? I know a few. I guess some of them are paid well, but they often make a lot less than their students. They do have job security (like tenured teachers). Doctors don't make money because they help people. They make money, because people with money think…

> I know a lot of nurses. They make decent (not outrageous) money, but their work environment is frequently a shitshow. Many are quitting. You're conflating recent and broad economic trends with the specific conditions of a specific profession. Millions of Americans all over the country have been quitting and changing careers (it even has a name: "the Great Resignation"). This doesn't mean their conditions are shit,…

My fiancee is a nurse. Conditions are absolute shit, especially in states where the patient to nurse ratio isn't legally protected.

I think that the Great Resignation is even more obvious in nursing because of nursing contracts. Nurse contracting became really popular when the pandemic started because the hospitals were overwhelmed and contracts were ridiculously lucrative. Hospital management is always so short sighted that they just don't want to raise the pay of their core stuff. Core staff is paid on average $35/hour. Nursing contracts start at $60 and can go much higher. This has lead to the situation where the core staff resigns en masse and goes to work as a contractor (sometimes even at the same hospital).

The hospital where my fiancee is contracting now has literally 0 core nursing staff left. There is not a single full time nurse employed in the whole hospital. Problem is that the contractors leave after ~3 months and go look for a more high paying contract so they are rarely at the same hospital for a long time.

The result is that you don't have a single nurse in the hospital that actually knows that hospital's procedures, doctors, people to call, storage lockers, and all of that institutional knowledge that you need to have to be effective.

Re: I quit the tech industry (2015)

#193
post #127

> I had stock options, and I cashed them all in last week. I net enough to pay off the mortgage, so I’m doing that, which will leave the entire household debt-free and cut our expenses drastically. There’s not a whole lot left after that (lol taxes ), but I can keep us afloat for a while. There you go. These type of post piss me the hell off!!! This type of person you will see making a video on YouTube convincing man…

So, my future post of a similar vein is not welcome. I think there is a deep issue when so many people just stay in the fire long enough. Is this ideal? It feels wasteful, but I get it as I got out.

Fun fact, it helped to tell people my goals and I could have brass tax conversations about peoples careers. As a mentor, once you move from 'how you can help the company' to 'how you can retire early by selling what the company thinks it needs', you can drop so many facades.

Re: I quit the tech industry (2015)

#194
post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A baker, landscaper, or small business owner doesn't need to do 10 years of additional education at specialize schools, not that they're less beneficial. The charitable reading of the OP's comments would be that it's an inefficient use of society's resources to invest in the education of these folks only to have them leave their respective fields after a short amount of time. The broader question is how do we change…

So there are a few problems. For one, that extra education? It often isn't seen as part of one's career. But for any course worth its salt, those years are still draining. It's a minor point, but also an overlooked one. Second, there's the mismatch problem. Outside STEM, loads of people aren't getting jobs in their fields. Inside STEM (mostly tech, really), most people are getting tech jobs completely different from…

I love the use of the word boggled here. As an idiot when it comes to office politics I can relate

Re: I quit the tech industry (2015)

#195

We talk about externalities. A chemical company pours toxins into a river, an automaker knows its products kill X people per year. These are tangible, understandable. But we don't yet think of the effects on the workforce as social externalities. Industrial safety has made the workplace a much safer space physically, but not mentally. The reality is, a great many jobs make us sick. Depression, anxiety, heightened agg…

> The reality is, a great many jobs make us sick. Depression, anxiety, heightened aggression, sedentary atrophy, getting overweight because there's no time for the gym... the modern office workplace is no heath-farm. And Google throwing a few coloured bean bags around, or providing healthy food and gym equipment is only a sticking plaster if the foundational culture is toxic. What is the cost to society? I have no id…

> maybe that work itself is inherently unhealthy (which I kind of believe, but at least until we have automation meeting our physical needs 'work' seems healthier for society).

You remember the Tom Sawyer story, where he gets the others to paint the fence for him? Work is very much "in the mind". You can have the work of Sisyphus and get to love the rock. In the best cases work is the making of some people. It can liberate you from boredom and self indulgence. An artist or poet talks about their "work" in an entirely different spirit. We must not equate indentured servitude, wage slavery, and pointless anxiety driven makework for "real work".

> without foregoing the actual productivity

Please don't fall for that 18th century factory-owner terminology. Producing what? Productivity is a slippery word. Unless you're a farmer most of us can't point to anything tangible we produce. The best we can hope for is to help fellow human beings in whatever small way we can each day. Increasingly that is done by subverting the system. Worthwhile work occurs despite, not through the systems we inhabit.

Re: I quit the tech industry (2015)

#196
Even the most interesting technical things Yelp is doing probably involve reinventing something hundreds of other companies have already reinvented, because the existing things don’t work with their infrastructure or they’re written in the wrong language or they’re just kinda bad and maybe doing it from scratch will be better.

After 20-some-odd years in the industry... oof.

Sometimes it feels like groundhog day. You might have thought about web application authorization. You may have implemented it a few times and figured out how it ought to be done. And you might think that after twenty years it would be a solved problem.

But you would be wrong.

You're going to encounter yet another web application with a bespoke authorization system. It's going to take a shotgun approach to validation and nobody will be able to tell you if it works the way it's supposed to or not. The tests pass (if there are any). It might have errors in it but we haven't had any reports yet. We hired a pentester last year and they didn't find anything. It's probably fine.

So you add a new feature and you need to extend this authorization system to handle it and you spend most of your time trying to make sure things continue working instead of focusing on what matters. The same thing over and over again. The same libraries, the same mistakes, the same solutions.

Re: I quit the tech industry (2015)

#197

Seems like a huge # of techies I meet out here are trying to reach a million dollars in savings in a job they hate so that they can "go live in a cabin in the woods." I try to tell them that my Cousin has been doing that for 40 years, and he dropped out of high school and worked at a gas station.

It’s easy to overlook one aspect: because of the skill and work history of the retired techie, they have the option to re-enter the industry and earn higher income if needed. That is a big security blanket.

Re: I quit the tech industry (2015)

#198

Seems like a huge # of techies I meet out here are trying to reach a million dollars in savings in a job they hate so that they can "go live in a cabin in the woods." I try to tell them that my Cousin has been doing that for 40 years, and he dropped out of high school and worked at a gas station.

One of the weirder side effects of the early retirement (FIRE) movement is that it selects for people who value freedom and time away from work and then convince them that they need to work the highest paid job they can find no matter how miserable it makes them right now. A lot of tech companies capitalize on this by offering 20% raises to recruit people and then demand 50-100% more work until they burn out. They ca…

I'm doing the weird thing you're describing right now!

I have a miserable high paying tech job that I would absolutely not do if I wasn't being paid so well.

Maybe I'm delusional, but I believe this is my best strategy for buying my freedom.

The way I see it, it takes about $3M to bond yourself away from a lifetime of servitude. That much capital would allow me to pay myself a middle class income without any time commitment.

The best answer would have been to have rich parents with a large trust fund so I could go pursue my interests without worry. I don't have rich parents, but that doesn't change my requirements.

So instead, I'm going about acquiring the funds I need by whatever legal means I can, which in practice means job hopping at tech companies, looking for equity payouts, and buy/borrow/die with companies and funds that I anticipate to be around for 50+ years.

Of course, I don't get to have kids with this strategy, but ethically I wouldn't want to birth a child into a life of bondage under capitalism anyway. It happened to me and I'm not particularly keen on how it's going. At $10M+ I may reconsider, but I don't expect to get there in my lifetime.

Re: I quit the tech industry (2015)

#199

We talk about externalities. A chemical company pours toxins into a river, an automaker knows its products kill X people per year. These are tangible, understandable. But we don't yet think of the effects on the workforce as social externalities. Industrial safety has made the workplace a much safer space physically, but not mentally. The reality is, a great many jobs make us sick. Depression, anxiety, heightened agg…

I'm curious how you got the estimate of $100,000 cost to society to educate a graduate? Are you including undergrad or just grad programs? If we include undergrad and do ballpark math: government pays 40 billion in grants per year, there are 20 million students, so that's 2 thousand per student cost to society Whereas I'm paying upwards of 30k. The cost is on me, not on society. Although I'm just an anecdote so I'm c…

I literally pulled that number out of my arse based on some vague recollection of such a figure. It may be conservative, or grossly exaggerated, but I think it's ballpark for the "cost of creating a graduate". The costs are complex because, for example, a student at college is not (except by paying my salary as a professor) participating in the economy for three years.

Re: I quit the tech industry (2015)

#200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm doing that now. For free. I've written infrastructure software that has, without a doubt, saved a lot of lives, and will continue to do so, for many years to come. I've been working on a client implementation that leverages that software, for the last couple of years. It's approaching ship (but still a ways off). One of the goals of that project, is to help train a few young friends in the ins and outs of what it…

> But I did them for no money And I assume you acquired the means to do that for free by.. doing the opposite for long enough to buy you freedom to do so? Or marry/born rich?

> > But I did them for no money

> And I assume you acquired the means to do that for free by.. doing the opposite for long enough to buy you freedom to do so? Or marry/born rich?

By working my butt off for over 30 years, making a rather humble salary, but never living large, avoiding personal debt like the plague, driving old cars, or crappy company cars, living in apartments and a small house, saving 25-40% of my earnings, investing in conservative, yet still a bit aggressive, funds, and then, after leaving a job I stayed at for nearly 27 years (at a famous Japanese imaging corporation, that makes optical equipment), being rejected (sometimes, quite rudely) by every place I applied at, for being too old.

The first project I mentioned was done over a period of ten years, as a "side project," while I worked as an Engineering Manager (a job I hated). I did it because my life was, literally, saved, by an organization, and I wanted to Give Back.

There are many reasons to do things that don't involve avarice, ego, anger, or cynicism. I want to make the world a better place. My resources are limited, but I have some ideas on ways to multiply my impact.

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