Why?
Why not?
Welcome to the M1 Windows project
161–170 of 276 posts
Re: Welcome to the M1 Windows project
#162Can't microsoft work on this instead? I don't get it.
Microsoft and Apple are traditional enemies. Microsoft has no reason to make Apple's hardware more attractive to customers. The thing I don't get is why a consumer would want this. You want an _extremely expensive_ windows laptop. I guess the hope would be that the battery life is worlds better than anything you'd get in standard windows-land. But in reality battery life optimization requires paying careful to the de…
Why would Microsoft not want this? They make money off of selling Windows licenses, not selling hardware (Yes, I'm aware the Surface exists). The more available hardware to install Windows etc on, the more $ Microsoft makes.
Re: Welcome to the M1 Windows project
#163hey, OP here, figured i'd clarify some things about this project: 1) yes, I realize this is going to be way harder than it seems, but I'm actually going to do my best to hopefully get a good user experience out of this and I'm easily preparing for this to be a multi-year effort, but I'm not going to give up right at the gate 2) Custom HALs were actually an option, up until very recently, since as of Windows 10, versi…
I was just really curious what your motivation for this project is. Just an interesting technical challenge? I'm impressed at anyone taking on something that is just so obviously ...difficult.
And don't you worry that if you succeed, either Apple or Microsoft will make some small change to kill it?
Re: Welcome to the M1 Windows project
#164Earlier quoted context omitted.
May I suggest you don't license the work in a way that allows it to be commercialized without your explicit permission and handsome compensation to you and any other contributors. You'll need this to be sustainable and it'll be incredibly frustrating if a company de-facto hijacks the development and takes it in a direction you don't expect or want.
IANAL but I'd like a license that goes something like this: Companies: If you are working for a company/corporation/profit-generating entity, or otherwise intend to sell or use such code derived from this repository for profit-generating purposes, you shall not be permitted to use any of the source code herein until you email me (author email here) and we can come up with the appropriate terms and conditions for your…
I mean, that's basically what CC-BY-NC is. Any licence that prohibits commercial use does not prohibit an alternative commercial licence being negotiated.
Re: Welcome to the M1 Windows project
#165hey, OP here, figured i'd clarify some things about this project: 1) yes, I realize this is going to be way harder than it seems, but I'm actually going to do my best to hopefully get a good user experience out of this and I'm easily preparing for this to be a multi-year effort, but I'm not going to give up right at the gate 2) Custom HALs were actually an option, up until very recently, since as of Windows 10, versi…
Good luck! At best you create something very cool. At the worst you learn something new.
Re: Welcome to the M1 Windows project
#166hey, OP here, figured i'd clarify some things about this project: 1) yes, I realize this is going to be way harder than it seems, but I'm actually going to do my best to hopefully get a good user experience out of this and I'm easily preparing for this to be a multi-year effort, but I'm not going to give up right at the gate 2) Custom HALs were actually an option, up until very recently, since as of Windows 10, versi…
> I have already delegated this to after I get Windows working under the thin hypervisor Not to be 'that guy', but that's an odd use of of the word 'delegated'. 'Relegated' might have been the word for which you were looking. Edit: I know this will be down voted because I'm critiquing the word usage of OP instead of focusing on how cool their project is. I get that. I'm just pedantic and this sort of thing eats me al…
My gripe here is saying "not to be that guy". Just own it.
Also my tip: if you're providing pedantry, it's much better if you contribute something substantive first.
Re: Welcome to the M1 Windows project
#167Earlier quoted context omitted.
It does. Officially there is an ARM build of Windows that Microsoft licenses to OEMs, and there is (or maybe was?) Windows IoT Core which has a build for ARM. If I recall (grain of salt then) a while after the first M1 Mac came out one of Apple’s VPs had said something on the record about Apple having tried to get Microsoft to sell retail licenses of a Windows 10 for ARM build, because they didn’t want to deprecate B…
We learned last November that Qualcomm had an exclusivity agreement for Windows on ARM that lasted a (speculated) 5 years... which they then did almost absolutely nothing worthwhile with. As of November it was "expiring soon" but what "soon" means is still not clear. Perhaps it was renewed. However, just two weeks ago Microsoft announced their "Project Volterra" Mac mini clone for Windows on ARM development, which ma…
However, just two weeks ago Microsoft announced their "Project Volterra" Mac mini clone for Windows on ARM development, which makes it seem mighty certain that Windows on ARM for Mac is not coming anytime soon because otherwise why on earth would anyone buy that thing…
Reading the tea leaves, if Windows were to come to Apple silicon Macs in an Apple-Microsoft mutually supported form, it would almost certainly be as a guest VM under the macOS hypervisor rather than as Boot Camp 2.0.
That would still leave room for Project Volterra.
Re: Welcome to the M1 Windows project
#168Earlier quoted context omitted.
You don't have to pirate windows, you have to buy Parallels, which then downloads and installs Arm windows onto your M1 - and Arm Windows will run x86 binaries. I used this to run FPGA bitstream-creation software on my Mac Studio. Worked like a dream. I'm generally fine with running on the PC on the bookshelf and serving s/w via MS Remote Desktop, but having it on the machine itself is a bit more useful in terms of s…
It's technically pirating because the license of Windows for ARM does not allow end users to run it on arbitrary hardware or virtualize it. I have doubts that they'd ever actually enforce those terms though.
I bought a Windows license and successfully activated WIN10 ARM running in Parallels.
Re: Welcome to the M1 Windows project
#169Earlier quoted context omitted.
Actually you might be surprised. Windows NT is _older_ than many of the "standards we take for granted in x86/PC land", and for example it does support multiple types of pre-ACPI ways of bringing up multiprocessor systems and specifically multiple types of interrupt controllers. Heck, x86 Windows even supports non-PC servers from Compaq and others; ever tried to press F5 during (old) Windows NT setup ? As the OP said…
> x86 Windows even supports non-PC servers from Compaq Were there x86 but non-IBM compatible models or did you mean the alternate instruction sets (Alpha, PPC, RISC)?
Not GP. I'm not sure if there's a special Compaq version but there's a version (until Windows 2000, https://winworldpc.com/download/5204c39d-c3a9-5a68-11c3-a7c2...) for NEC PC-98 architecture which is x86-based but IBM PC-incompatible, so it's likely that a Compaq version exists.
Re: Welcome to the M1 Windows project
#170Earlier quoted context omitted.
You don't have to pirate windows, you have to buy Parallels, which then downloads and installs Arm windows onto your M1 - and Arm Windows will run x86 binaries. I used this to run FPGA bitstream-creation software on my Mac Studio. Worked like a dream. I'm generally fine with running on the PC on the bookshelf and serving s/w via MS Remote Desktop, but having it on the machine itself is a bit more useful in terms of s…
Parallels in operating in a legal gray area and using Insider builds of Windows on ARM that are not licensed for M1 hardware. There is currently no legal way, from a licensing standpoint, to have an ARM build running on a device that Microsoft does not have an existing agreement with. If you're running an M1 with Parallels in any type of business or money-making environment then you're putting yourself at risk.
> There is currently no legal way, from a licensing standpoint, to have an ARM build running on a device that Microsoft does not have an existing agreement with.
That appears to be incorrect[0]:
> Fortunately, they had something to share later, again through an official Microsoft spokesperson (that faceless PR-driven process where press or analysts can ask Microsoft for an official response to a question). A lengthy Twitter thread on the topic[1] (driven by a new ARM64-based mini-desktop computer that ships with Windows 11 but without a license — until that was changed by the manufacturer of the device to say that it did indeed include a license) pointed to a blog post from Wes Miller[2], an analyst and licensing expert with Directions on Microsoft[3]. That post included this quote:
>> Yes customers can use retail copies to run Windows 10/11 on Macs, including ARM Macs. The Windows retail EULA does not have any use rights restrictions on the type of device you install Windows on. Note that the EULA does stipulate that not all versions of Windows are supported on all device types, so theoretically customers could run into compatibility issues with performance & support case by case, but this is not a licensing restriction. Customers can find more details on compatibility at https://aka.ms/minhw.
[0] https://oofhours.com/2022/04/12/microsoft-will-let-you-run-w...
[1] https://twitter.com/mniehaus/status/1512962942165262337
[2] https://getwired.com/2022/02/03/can-you-run-windows-on-arm-o...