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EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

engadget.com

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Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#721

Post by afiori »

HPsquared wrote: post #344
mrtksn wrote: post #233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

EU is a densely populated place where having multiple charging networks of incomparable plugs will be horrible. When you are not happy with decisions the governments make, it usually means that you should be involved in the process of making the decisions. Europeans don't trust that the industry will always come up with the best solutions for the user, Americans usually don't trust the government doing something well…

Being densely-populated makes it easier to have a range of different plugs, since there will be a range of alternatives, and you'll be able to find the right one for you nearby. Consider the opposite of a sparsely-populated region, where the next charging point may be 50 miles away. In that case, having a random hodge-podge of competing connectors could have actual consequences. In practice though, there is not much…

If the solution would be to use a lot of random adapters then we should simply standardize from the start.

If 35% of ICE had square gas sockets and we had to keep around square-to-circle adapters the situation would not be better.

An EV charging port is handful of metal rods with a handle.

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#722

Post by privacyking »

PinguTS wrote: post #72
schleck8 wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> makes it for the average consumer a nightmare. No, it doesn't. Almost all my devices (macbook, camera, speaker, phone, headphones...) use usb c pd and I am using the same three cables interchangeably for all of them, no issues. If Apple choses to intentionally break this compatibility it's a user hostile company.

If everything is so cool, so why is this Google engineer reviewing USB-C cables? https://www.theverge.com/2015/11/5/9674462/usb-type-c-google...

That same engineer also said the following

All passive USB-C cables support PD 2.0 or 3.0, all charging features. The only things a cable needs to need to support PD are:

Vbus wire Gnd wire CC wire Therefore, all USB cables, even the lowest end USB 2.0 cable support USB PD. You don't need an identifier chip to support basic USB PD charging.

Literally it's just the CC wire that goes end to end that enables USB PD charging from one end to the other.

USB PD is supposed to be backward and forward compatible, and a USB 2.0 cable can't actually differentiate itself as a USB PD 2.0 or PD 3.0 cable, since chances are it doesn't actually have an identifier chip. Your basic cable (which the Anker is) should work all the way up to 60W with PPS.

PPS also doesn't matter. A USB 2.0 C-to-C cable is supposed to support PPS.

----- In other words as long as you have any proper usb c cable (spec compliant) and a usb c Pd charger with sufficient power output, everything will work.

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#723

Post by mrtksn »

kukx wrote: post #699
ciupicri wrote: post #684

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

Agree 100%. The cookie law is the most visible failure of these regulations. I feel like they should pay me from their own pockets each time I have to click the cookie banner. And by their own pockets I mean the money they got from other sources than taxpayers money. Of course someone will argue that the intentions were good. Often they are! But it does not make it much better.

What failure? Now everyone knows they are tracked and it's an actual issue.

Besides, the websites could have chosen not to have that cookie window.

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#724

Post by midasuni »

Barrin92 wrote: post #649
leadingthenet wrote: post #506

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Let's say the USB consortium releases USB-D with input from Apple, Google, and many other stakeholders [...] If you have to make such an argument, you've already lost. Innovation, particularly disruptive and / or breakthrough innovation, does not happen by committee, no matter how many times over history people tried deluding themselves into thinking that it does. So no, it's not fine.

who needs breakthrough innovation for a charger? It's like the C++ programming language, I just want it to work everywhere. Programming languages have been designed by committee just fine.

Ok. Go back 5 years and standardise on the ubiquitous usb-mini — usb-a solution.

Why does my next phone need a charger? I’d be happy with wireless charging — especially if I have a 3.5mm socket in the phone too.

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#725

Post by ddalex »

samatman wrote: post #211
mrtksn wrote: post #123

By the way, that's also how Tesla and all other cars have the same electric plug in EU(not the USB mandate but the car plug standardisation mandate). Of course, the first thing that comes to mind is what happens if better solutions are found. Will EU block innovation? That question is addressed in the Q&A: https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/QANDA_... In essence, they seem to believe that wired char…

> Will EU block innovation? It already has. Tesla's connector is nicer (you can call that subjective but it isn't) and the supercharging network in the US is deploying the clunky standard sort of connector as well. If EU legislation were universal, that would preclude any future where the superior connector is licensed and takes over from the crappy designed-by-committee alternative, because Tesla would be forced to…

No it doesn't, in the legislation itself there is the provision of how to deal with technological advancements.

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#726

Post by ThatPlayer »

mikkergp wrote: post #199
RandomWorker wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That was the whole point of USB —- it’s in the name Universal Serial Bus. We have to talk about the ewaste issue, which is massive score on the earth. The particular village in China where all our waste get recycled is just a horrible scene. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electronic_waste_in_Guiyu This is a small step, but standardization is a great thing towards less waste.

Won’t this increase waste as lightning is deprecated?

Sure, but better now than in 5 or 10 years when there's more lightning cables out in the wild. Otherwise should we still be using lightning in 100 years?

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#727

Post by afiori »

bonzini wrote: post #648
potatochup wrote: post #356

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Random anecdote: I once got stuck at a friends place in Denmark with my Tesla, because the mobile connector wouldn't work. Turns out despite the voltage and socket being the same, the grounding can vary between countries and the connector wouldn't let me charge (this was back in 2016, I'm not sure if newer mobile connectors are better in that regard)

Is that because some places have 230V and neutral, while others have -115V and +115V (yes like in the US but in Europe)? There's a single neighborhood in Rome where that happens and car chargers don't work. The "solution" is to request a three-phase 400V connection: the utility company can't deny it and it must be 220V to neutral.

I would like to live in the alternative reality were all AC is three-phase AC; probably it would be uselessly more expensive for normal domestic stuff but it would be quite cooler.

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#728

Post by dreamcompiler »

mmastrac wrote: post #315
bestouff wrote: post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well they asked everyone to agree on a standard 10 years ago, but that didn't happen (just because of Apple). So now they forcefully decided.

This is the truth of the matter. Apple has been dragging their feet on switching away from lightning. Why? No idea. It's a much slower standard, and puts the wearing parts in the port instead of the cable. USB-C is designed by committee, sure, but the port itself is better than lightning in nearly every consumer metric there is.

Apple has repeatedly said their phones are so thin that they don't have room for a USB-C port. This of course is total bullshit because many phones as thin or thinner than iPhones have USB-C ports.

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#729

Post by midasuni »

I’d have preferred the requirement to be something that can be implemented with no parents or other controls. Invent lightning v2, great, you can use it as soon as the requirements for competitors to implement it are lodged in the appropriate place.

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#730

Post by mrzool »

samatman wrote: post #211
mrtksn wrote: post #123

By the way, that's also how Tesla and all other cars have the same electric plug in EU(not the USB mandate but the car plug standardisation mandate). Of course, the first thing that comes to mind is what happens if better solutions are found. Will EU block innovation? That question is addressed in the Q&A: https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/QANDA_... In essence, they seem to believe that wired char…

> Will EU block innovation? It already has. Tesla's connector is nicer (you can call that subjective but it isn't) and the supercharging network in the US is deploying the clunky standard sort of connector as well. If EU legislation were universal, that would preclude any future where the superior connector is licensed and takes over from the crappy designed-by-committee alternative, because Tesla would be forced to…

A good enough standard that works for everyone > dozens of cutting-edge amazing technologies competing with each other and no standardization
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