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EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

engadget.com

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Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#121

Post by lekevicius »

glogla wrote: post #15
lekevicius wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think this is the right take. - We already have reliable rumors that next-next iPhone (not this Sept, but next) will have USB-C port. - Qi is not a standard they control like Lightning either way. - Portless phone would be very unpopular (no fast charging), USB-C would be very popular. Apple would not choose to be unpopular just to watch the world hate them.

> - Portless phone would be very unpopular (no fast charging), USB-C would be very popular. Apple would not choose to be unpopular just to watch the world hate them. The same Apple which removed headphone jack so they can sell more dongles and wireless headphones? I can see them making portless phone just out of pure spite (maybe having cheaper version with port and not selling that in EU).

> I can see them making portless phone just out of pure spite (maybe having cheaper version with port and not selling that in EU).

What kind of mindset is this? Sometimes Apple prefers aesthetics over practicality, but they are not a spiteful company (unless you are Nvidia), particularly when it hurts customers.

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#122

Post by est31 »

akmarinov wrote: post #97

That's very interesting, not because the new iPhone would have a USB-C, but due to the fact that Apple continues selling older phones. Currently they sell the SE, 11, 12 and 13 By 2024 they will be selling a SE, 13, 14 and 15. Will they rework the SE, 13 and 14 to get USB-C? Will they stop selling them just in Europe? That's potentially a lot of money left on the table.

For cars, changes like these are phased in multiple steps. For each car model, companies mass producing cars have to obtain a permit for the model. Then, they are allowed to sell those cars. At which point the individual owners get their cars registered at the government office.

The phasing in happens by first requiring it for permits for new models. The manufacturers can still build and sell older models. A few years later, the rule also applies to all first registration of new cars, to prevent car manufacturers to avoid the new rules by keeping to produce an older model.

IDK if something similar exists for electric household devices. For the famous light bulb ban, they introduced it via import and manufacturing restrictions, so you could still sell the light bulbs, and still can today, but you can't either build new light bulbs or (legally) get light bulbs from outside of the EU into the EU.

You could do the same for phones, just ban the imports at a specified date in the future so that the hardware can be readjusted in time.

Anyways, this only affects one manufacturer (Apple) and they don't have as much of a market share here as in the US.

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#123

Post by mrtksn »

By the way, that's also how Tesla and all other cars have the same electric plug in EU(not the USB mandate but the car plug standardisation mandate).

Of course, the first thing that comes to mind is what happens if better solutions are found. Will EU block innovation?

That question is addressed in the Q&A: https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/QANDA_...

In essence, they seem to believe that wired charging is mature enough for standardisation but further technologies can be implemented through "Radio Equipment Directive". In the same time, it appears that the wireless charging is unaffected because the tech is new and fast changing, therefore the manufacturers can include whatever wireless charging they see fit.

It really boils down to "No funny cables, why don't you try wireless charging of your liking if USB-C doesn't cut it for you?".

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#124

Post by vladvasiliu »

kalleboo wrote: post #82
2000UltraDeluxe wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The idea's nice. I'll still have about 30 unusable micro-USB chargers lying around, though.

Interesting, I've never seen a charger with microUSB permanently attached, all my chargers have a USB-A port where you can change the cable. In any case, you can just stick tiny plug adapters on all your chargers. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07G54XXZZ/

I have an old Blackberry charger that has the cord attached, and I'm pretty sure I also have some old Samsung charger that's the same. But they're clearly quite rare.

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#125

Post by vladvasiliu »

kalleboo wrote: post #57
rob_c wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Great until you have some "sales rep" in a supermarket dealing with a Karen who's device won't charge fast enough off a 10W USBC charger that fundamentally isn't the same as a 60W one.

That's not new to USB-C though, there was already a wide range of charging speeds on USB-A

Yeah, but now there are the bonus points for a "fastish" USB-A charger (QC something, that puts out ~20W) which won't do anything to a laptop that requires "PD", even though the 20W would be enough to at least slowly charge the battery while off.

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#127

Post by rbanffy »

PinguTS wrote: post #110
rbanffy wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You haven't brought any of those cheap Chinese cables, haven't you? Do you expect them to follow standards while being impossibly cheap to pay for the licensing of said standards?

What you expect will average Joe buy at Amazon? What will be the key of comparing one cable with another?

Why would Amazon be selling non-compliant cables? Wouldn't that kind of be against the law?

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#128

Post by Quanttek »

kingsleyopara wrote: post #108

This all seems pretty short sighted. Great in the short term (I want a USB-C iPhone and for everything today to be USB-C) but will surely be a pain going forward - where would USB-C be if this policy had standardised on micro USB earlier? Some will say wireless is the future but I’m not convinced. Maybe the best solution would be to have this policy expire after a certain number of years?

The article already hints at it, but lawmakers are not completely dense and allow for relatively easy amendments by the Commission. From the legislation [1]:

> "With respect to radio equipment capable of being recharged via wired charging, the Commission is empowered to adopt delegated acts in accordance with Article 44 to amend Annex Ia in the light of technical progress, and to ensure the minimum common interoperability between radio equipment and their charging devices, by: (a) modifying, adding or removing categories or classes of radio equipment; (b) modifying, adding or removing technical specifications, including references and descriptions, in relation to the charging receptacle(s) and charging communication protocol(s), for each category or class of radio equipment concerned."

[1] https://ec.europa.eu/docsroom/documents/46755

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#129

Post by akmarinov »

est31 wrote: post #122
akmarinov wrote: post #97

That's very interesting, not because the new iPhone would have a USB-C, but due to the fact that Apple continues selling older phones. Currently they sell the SE, 11, 12 and 13 By 2024 they will be selling a SE, 13, 14 and 15. Will they rework the SE, 13 and 14 to get USB-C? Will they stop selling them just in Europe? That's potentially a lot of money left on the table.

For cars, changes like these are phased in multiple steps. For each car model, companies mass producing cars have to obtain a permit for the model. Then, they are allowed to sell those cars. At which point the individual owners get their cars registered at the government office. The phasing in happens by first requiring it for permits for new models. The manufacturers can still build and sell older models. A few year…

Apple sells 50 million out of 250 million phones in the EU.

Imagine if their revenue drops by 20%...

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#130

Post by ubermonkey »

It's just really not clear to me that regulators need to be mandating product design.

I have no expectation, for example, that these same regulators will stay on top of this and revise it when USB-C stops being the preferred or best choice.

Twenty years ago, we really DID have a snarl of competing and proprietary phone ports. It was a mess -- Blackberry chargers didn't work with Palm; most WinMo devices had their own ports; etc. It was ugly.

Now, pretty much everything is either USB or Lightning. This is good! What problem is the EU solving here?

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