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Is Everything an MLM? (2019)

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Re: Is Everything an MLM? (2019)

#41

Post by nonameiguess »

gruez wrote: post #8
msla wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's the politically-correct term for pyramid scheme these days. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multi-level_marketing > MLM salespeople are, therefore, expected to sell products directly to end-user retail consumers by means of relationship referrals and word of mouth marketing, but more importantly they are incentivized to recruit others to join the company's distribution chain as fellow salespeople so that these can…

>politically-correct term I don't get it. Were people getting canceled for saying "pyramid scheme" or something?

The person you're replying to really means to say "euphemism," or inventing a new term to avoid the negative connotations of an existing term that already fits. Sometimes euphemisms are motivated by political correctness, but not always and definitely not in calling a business model mostly indistinguishable from illegal pyramid schemes multi-level marketing.

Re: Is Everything an MLM? (2019)

#42

Post by paxys »

mandevil wrote: post #30

My wife is a pharmacist. Over the past two decades the number of pharmacy schools has increased and some schools have gotten bigger classes, such that now every year there are about 25% more Pharm.D's made than in 2005. The result has been a predictable decrease in pharmacist quality of life- the pay is basically the same number of dollars today that you would get in 2005 so inflation has made them poorer, the hours…

> I remain puzzled as to why software engineering seems to be immune to this overproduction problem.

Few reasons:

- While an ever increasing number of prospective students enter the field, a much lower number actually graduate.

- People that do graduate quickly get weeded out in technical interviews. This is why you see a high disconnect between unemployed devs and companies who claim they can't find talent.

- Of course the number of competent engineers in the field is going up as well, but that is matched by increased demand, as pretty much every company is now employing programmers for some business process.

Re: Is Everything an MLM? (2019)

#44

Post by superdisk »

guerrilla wrote: post #28
rlili wrote: post #10

> That’s what happens when an industry is fully enveloped by capitalism Yep, I'd say that capitalism itself is an MLM.

Can you elaborate as to why you think so?

It requires ever increasing growth to function and the world's resources are finite.

Re: Is Everything an MLM? (2019)

#45

Post by JumpCrisscross »

monkeybutton wrote: post #17
superb-owl wrote: post #7

There's definitely a trend where large corporations/institutions push risk and liability down onto individuals, who have a hard time quantifying it properly. They make promises about "independence" and "entrepreneurship" and "building wealth", but they're really just taking advantage of an information asymmetry, tricking uninformed individuals into accepting a deal that is much worse than they think. See: Uber, Subwa…

Any kind of sales where you are buying leads or paying for the right sell someone else's product. If it was as good as they say, they'd be doing it themselves not pitching it to you.

> it was as good as they say, they'd be doing it themselves not pitching it to you

Counterfactual: franchises.

Re: Is Everything an MLM? (2019)

#46

Post by lordnacho »

mandevil wrote: post #30

My wife is a pharmacist. Over the past two decades the number of pharmacy schools has increased and some schools have gotten bigger classes, such that now every year there are about 25% more Pharm.D's made than in 2005. The result has been a predictable decrease in pharmacist quality of life- the pay is basically the same number of dollars today that you would get in 2005 so inflation has made them poorer, the hours…

Software engineering isn't tied to one particular business model, like pharmacy, oil, or airlines. There's the "software industry" and there's all the industries who also have software developers. Big tech has had a massive boom, pushing up salaries. I'm not so sure devs outside of the official software industry are doing great (are they? Someone comment), though of course there's an evaporation of talent to the higher paying area.

Re: Is Everything an MLM? (2019)

#47

Post by sky-kedge0749 »

guerrilla wrote: post #28
rlili wrote: post #10

> That’s what happens when an industry is fully enveloped by capitalism Yep, I'd say that capitalism itself is an MLM.

Can you elaborate as to why you think so?

Not GP, but here's an answer to your question in the form of a jigsaw puzzle: https://www.etsy.com/listing/739198964/crimethinc-pyramid-of...

Re: Is Everything an MLM? (2019)

#48

Post by cwp »

mandevil wrote: post #30

My wife is a pharmacist. Over the past two decades the number of pharmacy schools has increased and some schools have gotten bigger classes, such that now every year there are about 25% more Pharm.D's made than in 2005. The result has been a predictable decrease in pharmacist quality of life- the pay is basically the same number of dollars today that you would get in 2005 so inflation has made them poorer, the hours…

I'm sure that we haven't found the limit yet. Usually this kind of discussion turns to supply-and-demand economics and somebody says that if you want to hire software engineers you just have to offer more. That's not wrong, but it too narrow a view. A free labour market ensures that skilled people get allocated to the highest value work, which is a great outcome for everyone. But there are so many projects that never happen at all because software engineers are so scarce. The cost of a software project is not just paying the engineers to do the work, it also has to get over the hurdle of finding, evaluating and enticing them to join the project in the first place.

Re: Is Everything an MLM? (2019)

#49

Post by ghaff »

RicoElectrico wrote: post #27
superb-owl wrote: post #7

There's definitely a trend where large corporations/institutions push risk and liability down onto individuals, who have a hard time quantifying it properly. They make promises about "independence" and "entrepreneurship" and "building wealth", but they're really just taking advantage of an information asymmetry, tricking uninformed individuals into accepting a deal that is much worse than they think. See: Uber, Subwa…

Yeah, I just don't understand how franchises are able to get away with their shitty tactics, at least in the EU. They do not provide any net value to the society, all they do is shift the risk onto the franchisee with a pretty much unilateral contract. You have to engage in whatever shit they come up with, like buying expensive equipment. (McDonald's pizza anyone?) The only instances where a franchise makes sense is…

While Subway franchises specifically don't seem to be especially profitable, others aren't bad and a local businessman can own multiple. Overall, it's probably a safer bet--though possibly less non-financially rewarding--than going independent.

https://www.eposnow.com/us/resources/how-much-do-franchise-o...

Re: Is Everything an MLM? (2019)

#50

Post by sumy23 »

mandevil wrote: post #30

My wife is a pharmacist. Over the past two decades the number of pharmacy schools has increased and some schools have gotten bigger classes, such that now every year there are about 25% more Pharm.D's made than in 2005. The result has been a predictable decrease in pharmacist quality of life- the pay is basically the same number of dollars today that you would get in 2005 so inflation has made them poorer, the hours…

Obviously the software industry is growing much faster than the oil industry, so yes, the industry has not yet satiated its demand for software engineers. That time is coming, of course.

You do seem to be discounting a STEM career / education, however. E.g. stating that "STEM jobs [won't] save you." Yes, there isn't much growth in the oil industry for chemical engineers or in the construction industry for civil engineers, but that doesn't necessarily mean the work or jobs are bad. You can still earn a decent living doing fun, mentally challenging work. You might not make 600k a year doing it, but you can probably get close to 400k household income if your partner also does it.

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