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1k True Fans? Try 100 (2020)

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Re: 1k True Fans? Try 100 (2020)

#31

Post by garbagetime »

alephnan wrote: post #6

> We’re already seeing this shift, according to creator platforms... Patreon... Podia... Teachable No OnlyFans? > One creator on Teachable who advises artists on how to sell their art made $110,000 last year with only 76 students, at an average of $1,437 per course. Another creator who teaches physiotherapy made $141,000 with only 61 students, at an average price point of $2,314 per course So sell shovels?

This article was written a couple years back. I'm not sure OnlyFans was as big then as it is now.

Re: 1k True Fans? Try 100 (2020)

#32

Post by Ekaros »

newaccount74 wrote: post #26
RcouF1uZ4gsC wrote: post #20

> Another creator who teaches physiotherapy made $141,000 with only 61 students, at an average price point of $2,314 per course. This seems like a scam. To be a physiotherapist in the United States, you have to have a bachelor’s degree (4 years) followed by a 3 year Doctor of Physical Therapy degree from an accredited college. https://www.apta.org/your-career/careers-in-physical-therapy... So the people paying that m…

I don't know anything about this teacher, but they might already be physiotherapists and doing additional courses on some speciality. It's common for health workers to take additional classes to stay on top of things. Some countries require certain professions to take some number of classes every few years to keep their license.

And describing those situations as "Fans" just feels wrong. It is clearly offering a service as product. And basically buying the possibly relevant certificate for participation.

Re: 1k True Fans? Try 100 (2020)

#33

Post by ringworld »

wodenokoto wrote: post #17

I'm quite interested in learning more about what kind of things people are willing to pay 80-100 USD a month for on Patreon. The author also throws around some percentages of the growth of hig end payers on Patreon, but no hard numbers. Did it increase by 5 people? Are high paying patrons growing faster than low paying?

While it doesn't fit TFA's premise of 100 on one thing, Patreon is used as a donation platform by many groups, for example i know of several online radio platforms using it (when asked "why not Liberapay?", they say Patreon helps take care of business and tax issues, provides an API, etc.). DKFM uses the API to display their Patreon donors on the website for example.

Sci-fi publications use it as well for monthly subscriptions - the general math holds up that some people spend $5/$10 per thing totalling up to $100/mo (or some variation). But I don't think that supports what TFA is suggesting $100/thing/mo), that feels like a lot. They might believe the Patreon user only supports one thing/mo, but I'm not sure that's true - people have varied interests based on my travels.

Re: 1k True Fans? Try 100 (2020)

#34

Post by esrauch »

wodenokoto wrote: post #17

I'm quite interested in learning more about what kind of things people are willing to pay 80-100 USD a month for on Patreon. The author also throws around some percentages of the growth of hig end payers on Patreon, but no hard numbers. Did it increase by 5 people? Are high paying patrons growing faster than low paying?

On Twitch people commonly give $100 for absolute nothing, just to be thanked by the creator live, which they would do for significantly less money as well, often just $5.

I suspect the top tiers at Patreon must work the same, there's some benefit there but people are doing it because they are a megafan and want to show it. I'd be intested in how many of them are living in a false belief / parasocial relationship though.

Re: 1k True Fans? Try 100 (2020)

#35

Post by Applejinx »

Of course this poses other challenges. You'll end up an 'artist' of gilding toilet seats for rich and demanding 'customers' who are very clear on what they want.

That ain't me: my branding is aligned with what my actual values and heritage are, and it's profoundly oriented towards the folks who have skills and dreams but no resources, and so I make open source software supporting 'em.

I get excited when I can support a new platform like the new Raspberry Pi, not about thinking up stuff to excite about three of my audience who could throw me a hundred bucks a month. If I go over to serving only them I'll be doing only as they direct, and they absolutely don't have the vision to run my show and get anywhere worthwhile with it.

This doesn't make the article worthless. I've been thinking very hard about how I can expand into hardware DIY and the article hints at possibilities there. I can try to come up with a DIY synth module that comes in under $20 for my primary base… or, apparently, if I can make the ultimate speaker cabinet using all my tricks and sell it to someone for $200, I could also execute it in the most sophisticated possible way, and sell it for $2000 to a superfan who is that kind of wealthy. The $20 guy can't afford either, but the $2000 guy doesn't need me to hold it to $200, they need me to make it special for them.

Risk of course is if the $2000 guy doesn't exist or doesn't show up. Trying to target only the wealthy is dangerous. They are as fickle as your attitude towards them is. There's exactly one guy out there who randomly gave me $1000, and rather than demand a product, he wanted me to think about spherical harmonics in the belief that I might come up with something helpful in the field that interested him. I suspect there are guys out there who would likewise give me $1000 on the condition that I abandon what I do and start doing what they would do if they were me…

Re: 1k True Fans? Try 100 (2020)

#36

Post by PragmaticPulp »

wodenokoto wrote: post #17

I'm quite interested in learning more about what kind of things people are willing to pay 80-100 USD a month for on Patreon. The author also throws around some percentages of the growth of hig end payers on Patreon, but no hard numbers. Did it increase by 5 people? Are high paying patrons growing faster than low paying?

Agreed. It seems like examples should be easy to find and highlight if it’s really as common as this article suggests.

I’ve seen people spontaneously put $100 toward creators they really appreciate, but those are rare. $100 per month on a recurring basis or a constant influx of one-off $100 donations is a much higher bar. You would need a relatively massive audience to convert enough people interested in spending $1K/year on something.

Re: 1k True Fans? Try 100 (2020)

#37

Post by ryanbrunner »

I work for a company that's very much like Patreon for podcasters (Supercast). The people who will pay $1K a year to support a creator absolutely exist, but they are a small subset of the people who will pay $100 / year, which is itself a very small subset of the people who will listen to your podcast.

Some rough numbers:

- A podcast with an engaged fan base can usually get about 5% of their listeners to support them monthly / yearly

- Of the paid supporters, 1-2% are going to be the big spenders who spend in $1K a year territory.

So sure, you can be self-sufficient on 100 $1K a year fans, but to get there, you need 5,000 $100 / year fans (which needs 100,000 listeners), and not doing anything for them is leaving money on the table.

Re: 1k True Fans? Try 100 (2020)

#38

Post by mcherm »

So the point here is that you don't need as many fans if your fans are sufficiently rich?

I mean, it's true: one can make more money by [selling to / servicing / having as a patron] the rich, but it's not a new observation.

Re: 1k True Fans? Try 100 (2020)

#39

Post by jefftk »

oefrha wrote: post #14
tiborsaas wrote: post #8

This might be misunderstood as followers on social media, but a follower on social media does not equal to a fan. They address this at: > Here’s how it works: A creator can cultivate a large, free audience on horizontal social platforms or through an email list. Fair enough, but let's say the TrueFans™ are in the range of 0.1% - 1% of your followers. That translates to 10k-100k followers which is still incredibly har…

A true fan in TFA is willing to spend $1k a year. That’s gotta be way less than 0.1% in terms of social media followers (usually). A friend of mine has close to 3 million social media followers on one platform alone, and the number of “true fans (tm)” paying more than $1k a year is about ten to twenty. Of course it heavily depends on the category, too.

I think it depends on how you decide to structure your offerings? For example, someone who emphasizes 1-1 instruction can shift some people to much higher payment tiers, at the cost of turning away a larger number of people who aren't interested in that sort of thing.
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