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The $36 soda: Overdrafting in America

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Re: The $36 soda: Overdrafting in America

#131

Post by _delirium »

Natsu wrote: post #100
bermanoid wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm curious here: what are the benefits of using a credit union over a bank? What are the drawbacks? Right now I keep 95% of my money in investment accounts (I use Interactive Brokers these days, they have reasonable fees for trades and zero bullshit, which puts them two steps ahead of any normal bank that I know of), and push the remaining stuff to a throwaway checking account @BoA as needed to cover recurring payme…

The main advantage is that credit unions are member-owned and therefore run to benefit the members, not some investors. This keeps them from having an interest in screwing you via weird fees and whatnot. The main disadvantage I've seen is that smaller ones have less leverage and so you pay more ATM fees to other banks. I've been in the no credit card boat, so I know exactly what you mean. I got mine by having a car l…

> The main disadvantage I've seen is that smaller ones have less leverage and so you pay more ATM fees to other banks.

Many credit unions are now part of ATM networks where you can use any of the members' ATMs fee-free, and in some cases can use other members' branch offices for free as well (at least for routine stuff). Depends somewhat on your location and your ATM-using habits; if you need to use a random mall ATM that doesn't help, but there are usually several member ATMs nearby.

Re: The $36 soda: Overdrafting in America

#132

Post by matwood »

jeffool wrote: post #31
impendia wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please tell me that you called them, or walked into the nearest branch, and demanded that they reverse all but one of the charges, and, either (1) They agreed, or (2) You promptly closed your account.

After a long while of phone conversation, they told me "no". I went into the branch and talked to someone there. They also told me "no". Then their spouse walked in; I'd known their spouse for years it turned out! They wiped the fees out for me. That actually pissed me off a little more... But I certainly wasn't going to tell them that. I've not overdrafted since.

The second half of your conversation should have been to close your account and change banks.

Credit unions are the only banking institutions I will deal with now.

Re: The $36 soda: Overdrafting in America

#133

Post by caw »

TheRevoltingX wrote: post #89

I use Chase, and they tried to get me with this once. I had to call and yell at them and basically asked them how it's possible that they know I don't have funds and still let the transaction go through. I told them that their systems were faulty, and they told me this was a 'feature' of the account type. I told them I never asked for such a feature, and expect it to work like every other bank account where it denies…

I also turned off overdraft on my account, but I did this when I got my Wachovia debit card in the mail. It has as a $5000 per DAY limit of transactions. I called to get it lowered, to say $500 but they couldn't do it on my blue debit card. Since $5k was more than my checking account at the time I turned off overdraft so someone couldn't drain my savings account along with it.

Re: The $36 soda: Overdrafting in America

#134

Post by eftpotrm »

cperciva wrote: post #101
shabble wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've heard it mentioned as 'largest payment first', with the stated argument that it's most likely to be a loan or some other important payment, but has the practical effect of triggering charges on way more items. It's For Your Benefit, citizen. (Also, the cash advance interest differential for credit-cards, which is higher, and only paid off after all other charges are covered, rather than any sort of temporal orde…

Also, the cash advance interest differential for credit-cards, which is higher, and only paid off after all other charges are covered, rather than any sort of temporal ordering FWIW, in Canada credit card issuers are required to apply payments to whichever balances you're paying the highest interest rate on -- it's not even temporally ordered.

Are you complaining that they're required to service the more expensive (to you) debts first? Why?

UK banks used to have a god racket (don't know if they still do, don't read the relevant blogs) where they'd offer 0% balance transfer cards but with expensive purchase interest. Then, any payments you made went to paying off the oldest debt first (on which you were paying 0% interest) leaving the purchases quickly gaining high interest payments.

Re: The $36 soda: Overdrafting in America

#135

Post by Two9A »

fmavituna wrote: post #129

Banking in UK is so ridiculous, beside of all insane overdraft charges when you enter your PIN incorrectly (Pin & Chip is mandatory in many EU countries) your bank charges you for £1

Would you happen to know which bank is doing that at the moment? In the last year, I've had a debit or credit card from NatWest, Halifax, Lloyds, Santander, MBNA and Barclays; never had an "incorrect PIN" charge though.

If it's a new policy at one of those, I guess I'm closing my account...

Re: The $36 soda: Overdrafting in America

#136

Post by pbhjpbhj »

andrewljohnson wrote: post #23

I agree that banks are predatory, but the fact that people can't keep ~$500 in their bank account indicates they are spending more than they are earning. When someone can't keep an extremely small amount of cash on hand at all times. it doesn't mean they are living paycheck to paycheck and just netting zero - it means they are accruing debt every cycle, and then struggling to stay cash flow positive in any way necess…

>When someone can't keep an extremely small amount of cash on hand at all times. //

Your "extremely small amount of cash" is my families disposable income for the entire month. That is, all we have to live on after tax and direct housing costs.

A simple accident/incident (last year a small section of our roof caved in, the insurance company says it wasn't covered as there wasn't a 'storm') can wipe that amount out easily. It took us several months to afford the repair.

Of course if we'd be living off the state it would have been fixed immediately assisted by our tax payments ...

Re: The $36 soda: Overdrafting in America

#137

Post by matwood »

bermanoid wrote: post #99
ck2 wrote: post #83

STOP USING COMMERCIAL BANKS. Sorry for the caps but it cannot be stressed enough. There is no good reason not to use a credit union - almost everyone in the USA can find one and qualify and since they are member owned they won't do nonsense like this and don't need regulation to force them to do what is morally right.

I'm curious here: what are the benefits of using a credit union over a bank? What are the drawbacks? Right now I keep 95% of my money in investment accounts (I use Interactive Brokers these days, they have reasonable fees for trades and zero bullshit, which puts them two steps ahead of any normal bank that I know of), and push the remaining stuff to a throwaway checking account @BoA as needed to cover recurring payme…

The main advantage as mentioned above is that they don't tend to screw you. I'm a member of the a state credit union and have been for years. The people are more friendly, more helpful and overall provide a better experience. My cu offers all the things you listed and the only entry requirement for it is living in the state.

The downside, at least with my credit union, is that there are zero branches outside the state. When I lived in a different state for 2 years it wasn't a big deal since I could mail them checks for deposit and every store now offers cash back with even the smallest purchase (avoiding ATM fees).

BTW, BofA was the last bank I was ever at and I will tell everyone to avoid them like the plague. Simplifying numbers here, but someone gave me a $500 check that bounced. When the check bounced they took out the $500 (what they should have done), but then put a lock on the other $500 in the account. I went to branch and asked for an explanation. After a few explanations that didn't make any sense I told the manager I wanted to close my account right then and there. He said he couldn't, so I said I wasn't leaving until he did and threatened to call the police and claim theft (I was an idiot college kid at the time). Long story short, he closed the account, gave me a check and I have been a happy CU member ever since.

Re: The $36 soda: Overdrafting in America

#138

Post by rue »

shabble wrote: post #60
bdhe wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a very easy trap to fall into if you're living check to check and make even the slightest mistake. In each such story online, I've heard a claim that they specifically have algorithms to maximize the penalty fees on these mistakes. Its another instance of a practice that disproportionately affects the poor. Unless you're living paycheque to paycheque, you would never even bother looking into such niggling detail…

I've heard it mentioned as 'largest payment first', with the stated argument that it's most likely to be a loan or some other important payment, but has the practical effect of triggering charges on way more items. It's For Your Benefit, citizen. (Also, the cash advance interest differential for credit-cards, which is higher, and only paid off after all other charges are covered, rather than any sort of temporal orde…

> It's For Your Benefit, citizen.

I take exception to using “citizen”, here, since it implies the gov't is somehow at fault…

In reality, the banks had indeed devised such a scheme, and for the obvious reasons, but it's since been disallowed by government intervention, along with a few other things sucha as actually being able to opt out of overdraft “protection” (this was just a few years ago but fortunately I don't have to care about what US banks do anymore).

Re: The $36 soda: Overdrafting in America

#139

Post by Confusion »

davidw wrote: post #118
Confusion wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

OK, the reason I doubted it is because it is very easy for anyone to open an account in a neighbouring country and profit from the better arrangements there. I know people living in Germany who haven't bothered to open a local account, because their Dutch account works just fine.

Not all of Europe is quite so 'small scale'. It'd take me a couple of hours to drive to Slovenia, and 3 for Austria.

They are an 8-hour drive from their bank

Re: The $36 soda: Overdrafting in America

#140

Post by rdtsc »

jeffool wrote: post #2

I had an annoying run in with them. It happened because I didn't know Suntrust didn't take out charges in the order they occurred. They take out the largest charge first, and each charge as they decrease in value. One day I had had a few small charges, and realizing it was a week intl payday, I figured I'd run to the grocery store and make a large precise of groceries, to ensure I had food taken care of, expecting to…

No only that. SunTrust presents it to you as an "advantage" -- "We don't want your largest bills to be unpaid".

Somebody in the marketing and PR department got a bonus for making that shit up. It is like they slap you in the face, then smile at you and ask you how your day is going.

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