In what ways is this better than investing in a hypothetical public utility that intends to make all its electricity from solar panels?
In what ways is this worse than that?
Legends Solar – Buy operating solar panels on commercial solar farms
51–60 of 167 posts
Re: Legends Solar – Buy operating solar panels on commercial solar farms
#52This is basically a variation on the SolarCity business model, but focusing on commercial properties. There is probably a business here, but not one that tries to recruit individual investors because it will only be profitable at scale, and the kind of financial backing needed to do this is available to qualified teams. The recruiting individuals thing is basically an admission that this team does not have access to…
I see, your argument is that like (for instance) LendingClub, the economies of scale always favor large investors, and that this platform simply cannot get large investors onboard. That may be due to a lack of connections, or due to some other potential fundamental issues with the business model. At the end of the day if the business is sound it makes more sense to target fewer large investors - not many, smaller one…
No one in their right mind wants to build a pseudo-investment company dealing with tons of small investors in the few hundreds of dollars to few thousands of dollars range. The only thing missing here is a crypto coin.
If they really have a business model that can yield 8+% annual, assuming they get a cut, then they would raise real capital and not deal with randos. They don’t.
Re: Legends Solar – Buy operating solar panels on commercial solar farms
#53This is like a high-tech version of the orange grove that sold investment contracts for the harvest of oranges in the famous Howey case
Re: Legends Solar – Buy operating solar panels on commercial solar farms
#54This is basically a variation on the SolarCity business model, but focusing on commercial properties. There is probably a business here, but not one that tries to recruit individual investors because it will only be profitable at scale, and the kind of financial backing needed to do this is available to qualified teams. The recruiting individuals thing is basically an admission that this team does not have access to…
I see, your argument is that like (for instance) LendingClub, the economies of scale always favor large investors, and that this platform simply cannot get large investors onboard. That may be due to a lack of connections, or due to some other potential fundamental issues with the business model. At the end of the day if the business is sound it makes more sense to target fewer large investors - not many, smaller one…
What we are doing is super simple. Equity ownership in real, operating solar panels. There is nothing particularly synthetic or structured about these investments (i.e. like BNPL, etc.)
We need enough scale to move a large (20M+) facility, but beyond that scale will only help insofar as bringing on follow on investments and referrals becomes a bit easier. We may also do some institutional stuff, but for the time being, we are 100% consumer focused and always will be.
Our innovation is to bring a consumer experience and true design focus to investing. Instead of treating retail investors like tiny little hedge funds, we design the product to match their expectations of what 'ownership' should be.
Re: Legends Solar – Buy operating solar panels on commercial solar farms
#55Earlier quoted context omitted.
I see, your argument is that like (for instance) LendingClub, the economies of scale always favor large investors, and that this platform simply cannot get large investors onboard. That may be due to a lack of connections, or due to some other potential fundamental issues with the business model. At the end of the day if the business is sound it makes more sense to target fewer large investors - not many, smaller one…
What we are doing is super simple. Equity ownership in real, operating solar panels. There is nothing particularly synthetic or structured about these investments (i.e. like BNPL, etc.) We need enough scale to move a large (20M+) facility, but beyond that scale will only help insofar as bringing on follow on investments and referrals becomes a bit easier. We may also do some institutional stuff, but for the time bein…
That is not a competitive differentiator.
Re: Legends Solar – Buy operating solar panels on commercial solar farms
#56Earlier quoted context omitted.
Show your work. Justify your ROI estimate.
It will depend on so many factors. Our current accredited investors are getting about 10%+, but that's only because they have access to tax equity benefits. We are still in an early stage of creating the financial product, and the realized returns will be a function of the risk profile we choose (i.e. will there be construction risk, insurance, who is the power purchaser, etc.) Don't worry, you'll get a detailed fina…
So let me get this straight. You are soliciting engagement and don’t even have the financials worked out?
Re: Legends Solar – Buy operating solar panels on commercial solar farms
#57Earlier quoted context omitted.
I see, your argument is that like (for instance) LendingClub, the economies of scale always favor large investors, and that this platform simply cannot get large investors onboard. That may be due to a lack of connections, or due to some other potential fundamental issues with the business model. At the end of the day if the business is sound it makes more sense to target fewer large investors - not many, smaller one…
No one in their right mind wants to build a pseudo-investment company dealing with tons of small investors in the few hundreds of dollars to few thousands of dollars range. The only thing missing here is a crypto coin. If they really have a business model that can yield 8+% annual, assuming they get a cut, then they would raise real capital and not deal with randos. They don’t.
We will never work with crypto because we care about our investors and don't intend on defrauding them.
There are plenty of small retail investing companies that deal with small account sizes. Acorns, Robinhood, etc. come to mind. Over time, I'd hope that our average account size would be in the 10K+ range, but depending on CAC, small dollar would be fine.
Our innovation here is investment UX. The realized return might be a point or two north or south of 8% depending on the risk profile we go with - not far off course for the industry. Our current accredited investors get about 10%, but that's with tax equity incentives we might not be able to pass to retail investors.
We will be 100% transparent about our pricing model.
Re: Legends Solar – Buy operating solar panels on commercial solar farms
#58Earlier quoted context omitted.
gonna pile on here so it's easy for OP to answer. 4. What contracts are in place to maintain the panel, and lease the space? What happens if the building decides to discontinue service. Will the solar panel be delivered to me (at what fee?) will the solar panel be re-placed on top of another building? (at what fee?) 5. are the devices insured against common forms of damage? (wind, hail, acts of humankind) 6. Can we i…
These are all great questions - so far we've worked with accredited investors to place $100K+ solar facilities while we've built our product. They are basically beta testers while de get out design, software, payments integrations, etc going. We answered those questions for accredited, for everyday retail investors it will depend on the solar facility we select and the financial structuring design.
I really wanted to take you seriously but that's impossible if you won't answer any fo these simple questions. This is a real bad look that does not inspire confidence.
Re: Legends Solar – Buy operating solar panels on commercial solar farms
#59This is basically a variation on the SolarCity business model, but focusing on commercial properties. There is probably a business here, but not one that tries to recruit individual investors because it will only be profitable at scale, and the kind of financial backing needed to do this is available to qualified teams. The recruiting individuals thing is basically an admission that this team does not have access to…
> The recruiting individuals thing is basically an admission that this team does not have access to that kind of backing.
I would assume they plan to finance the large installations and then pay off the financing by re-selling the projects to retail investors in increments mapping to approximately 1 panel.
In theory they'd only need to keep enough working capital to fund installations until PTO (power turn on) at which point they could "sell" them to retail investors and turn over the capital for the next install.
In practice I'd be worried about what happens if (or when) the company goes out of business. Does my initial investment disappear and someone else now owns the solar installation?
This feels like an offer to become an investor in a risky solar install without any of the actual rights that come from being an investor in a solar install. If the company fails for whatever reason, your solar install goes to the company's investors and you get nothing.
A much better structure would be to operate as a solar holding and operations company and allow people to invest in the company (eventually publicly traded). This lets the investors keep actual ownership of the company and panels, not just some notional ownership on their platform that disappears the moment anything changes.
The way it's proposed here, they're breaking the traditional investment ownership chain and replacing it with some IOUs on the platform. What you really want is to own shares of the company that owns the solar installs, otherwise you get nothing and have no claim as a creditor when the business stops working.
Re: Legends Solar – Buy operating solar panels on commercial solar farms
#60In what ways is this better than investing in a hypothetical public utility that intends to make all its electricity from solar panels? In what ways is this worse than that?
> investing in a hypothetical public utility that intends to make all its electricity from solar panels?
Is this something I can do as a retail investor? What sort of minimum investment is needed?