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Bob Cassette Rewinder: Hacking Detergent DRM

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Re: Bob Cassette Rewinder: Hacking Detergent DRM

#61

Post by Wohlf »

causality0 wrote: post #5

I see the point of that dishwasher for someone who doesn't have easy access to a sink like a student in a dorm, but I can't fathom why you'd put one in a house or apartment. With such a tiny capacity you're better off hand washing.

If it was my only option due to lack of space or not being allowed to install a full-size, I'd still find it worthwhile now that I eat at home much more often.

One to two loads a day would handle everything but the pots and pans for me and my partner while we can do other things, plus it would still use less water and electricity.

Re: Bob Cassette Rewinder: Hacking Detergent DRM

#62

Post by lb1lf »

_0ffh wrote: post #33

After reading through the thing, I don't see any DRM at all. Just a simple counter for the machine to know when the cartridge is empty. Frankly, I feel deliberately mislead by the headline, as seems to be getting the norm these days. Edit: Kindly tell me where I'm wrong.

As far as the average end user is concerned, this amounts to the same thing as full-blown DRM; rather than being allowed to do the sensible and (for you as a consumer) cost-effective thing, this counter forces you to replenish detergent supplies at an artificially inflated price.

Re: Bob Cassette Rewinder: Hacking Detergent DRM

#63

Post by Cthulhu_ »

dylan604 wrote: post #44

ohmuhgawd! Until now, I had never seen this "tech". It is so obviously the ink jet of washers. why on earth would this seem like a good idea to anyone other than the manufacturer knowing the ink jet games that could be played. as a consumer why would this ever sound like a good enough idea to actually purchase?

> as a consumer why would this ever sound like a good enough idea to actually purchase?

Because as far as I know, there's no competing small sized kitchen-countertop dishwasher; that said, there's enough money on HN and its investors to start a company that does the same thing without the DRM and custom cartridges.

Re: Bob Cassette Rewinder: Hacking Detergent DRM

#64

Post by Eric_WVGG »

Aardwolf wrote: post #45

> No need to manually measure and add detergent each wash, very convenient! No difference between adding a dishwasher tablet in the detergent holder of a regular machine. In both cases you're manually adding 1 item into the machine. Except in the case of the dishwasher tablet, it comes from a box of 40 that you can easily buy in any supermarket.

… and the makers of the dishwasher even sell their own dishwasher tablets. The DRM cartridges are totally optional!

Fun device though, buying a similar countertop dishwasher was without question the best purchase of my adult life.

Re: Bob Cassette Rewinder: Hacking Detergent DRM

#65

Post by hguant »

causality0 wrote: post #5

I see the point of that dishwasher for someone who doesn't have easy access to a sink like a student in a dorm, but I can't fathom why you'd put one in a house or apartment. With such a tiny capacity you're better off hand washing.

1. Handwashing is water inefficient compared to a lot of dishwashers; if this is something that's important to you, a device like this makes ecologic, if not necessarily economic sense

2. Dishwashers are expensive to people not on tech salaries. All upfront costs are difficult; a smaller upfront payment with a recurring monthly/quarterly subscription payment is much more manageable for many people.

3. There are many homes in America that aren't configured for a dishwasher and it would be expensive/difficult to remodel to get one to fit. Anecdotally, my cousin out in has this problem - he and his wife would greatly appreciate a dishwasher in their lives, but their home was built in the 1940s and renovating isn't happening on a post-doc + special ed teacher's combined salary

Re: Bob Cassette Rewinder: Hacking Detergent DRM

#67

Post by paskozdilar »

throwaway09223 wrote: post #49
paskozdilar wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Noise pollution is my number one. There is simply no way to escape it living in the city, and there are no job opportunities for software engineers on the countryside (not that it's perfect on the countryside either - given all the motor-based tractors, chainsaws, lawnmowers, leafblowers...). I hate it and it's driving me crazy and all I want is peace and quiet, but apparently, that's too much to ask and I'm spoiled…

When I worked in San Francisco I lived in a quiet suburb a few miles from BART. I couldn't hear much of anything. In any event, nowadays it's extremely easy to get a full time remote gig and live in a truly remote location - especially factoring in lower cost of living. This doesn't seem like an actual problem. Actually, it seems like the industrial revolution has provided an idyllic outcome for people in your situat…

That's a good point, and one I have considered many times. It has its tradeoffs. I suppose right now it's much more important for me to be close to humans and to learn and develop myself, so it's a necessity for me to be here. Once I get a good enough remote job I will definitely move somewhere far away from everything.

Re: Bob Cassette Rewinder: Hacking Detergent DRM

#68

Post by bombcar »

paskozdilar wrote: post #42
Semaphor wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So which parts are bad enough that you’d prefer medieval serfdom?

Noise pollution is my number one. There is simply no way to escape it living in the city, and there are no job opportunities for software engineers on the countryside (not that it's perfect on the countryside either - given all the motor-based tractors, chainsaws, lawnmowers, leafblowers...). I hate it and it's driving me crazy and all I want is peace and quiet, but apparently, that's too much to ask and I'm spoiled…

If you own your house, spend the money for triple-glazed windows and have a sound/insulation gap check.

It helps tremendously.

Re: Bob Cassette Rewinder: Hacking Detergent DRM

#69

Post by Waterluvian »

Wow. So I'm watching the Techmoan review and it's just amazing. You've got this pretty awesome product.... up until you can clearly see the business types shoving their grubby hands in the way of UX and good engineering.

Oh no no no. We can't just sell a product. We need recurring revenue. So we'll make DRM proprietary detergent pods that require electronics in each one. Ah, but people will reject that because they know (and we clearly know) it's a horrible product design. So we'll include an option to just use your own. Of course, we'll turn the screws over time, incentivising use of our proprietary detergent until eventually we just get rid of the other option.

That whole thing seems to offer absolutely no added value to the customer. It's just making a good product inferior in order to grift more money from the customer.

If your business model requires this kind of thing, you should feel unceasing shame and failure.

Re: Bob Cassette Rewinder: Hacking Detergent DRM

#70

Post by cjbgkagh »

paskozdilar wrote: post #8
andai wrote: post #3

>Detergent DRM The industrial revolution and its consequences have been a disaster for the human race. (...) The continued development of technology will worsen the situation.

That quote (and the work it is taken from) is becoming more relevant by the day. I am very pessimistic about the future and I don't believe that we can fight against the enormous power that technology gives to those that can use it on a massive scale. I just hope that the eventual dictator will be a "soft-hearted leftist" and decide to turn the world into a huge human zoo, instead of some sadistic overlord that will…

I always considered that work to be optimistic in that he considered the predicted dystopian future to be avoidable. I never did. The ability to manipulate humans with technology is improving more rapidly than the ability to resist manipulation and there is no way to stop it.
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