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The saga of Apple’s troubled mixed reality headset

arstechnica.com

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Re: The saga of Apple’s troubled mixed reality headset

#101

Post by p_l »

moistly wrote: post #92

I am eternally surprised that Boeing has not developed augmented reality headsets for its maintenance crew. Overlaying specs and instructions onto the components being serviced would be a godsend for productivity, compliance, and personal safety. Edit: ditto for automotive assembly/repair. Power plant maintenance. Basically all complicated engineering fields could make excellent use of AR.

Boeing was involved with industrial version of Google Glass, Microsoft is pushing Hololens heavily in that space as well - in fact you can buy Hololens integrated with safety hat - and there's explicit stuff to integrate with MS ERP stuff. Uptake seems to be mainly in high end civil engineering so far, but a lot of those solutions are things you are not going to read about outside a niche press.

Re: The saga of Apple’s troubled mixed reality headset

#102

Post by [deleted] »

jayd16 wrote: post #64
Geee wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Their software and hardware are generally crappy, and I don't believe they can deliver anything innovate in a thousand years.

Can you explain what you mean? The Quest2 is easily the best stand alone headset and the hololens has the best world sensing. How can you say it's generally crappy? I consider it industry leading unless you get some niche devices that push up the spec sheet but are generally uninteresting.

[deleted]

Re: The saga of Apple’s troubled mixed reality headset

#103

Post by mettamage »

Geee wrote: post #30

Productivity is correlated with display size, and VR should be the next step in productivity, because it allows your whole space to become a display and an interface. When paired with powerful hardware and innovative software it should be the next step in computing. Therefore, VR should be a replacement for large displays in productive work, not a device that everyone is wearing outside or casually watching videos wi…

> It would be possible to dive into code and see it all at once like an intricate factory. Our brains are capable of navigating very complex environments, but this capability is lost when its viewed through a small window.

This is such an Engelbart-esque statement. Bravo! I'd love for AR to go there too :)

Re: The saga of Apple’s troubled mixed reality headset

#104

Post by DangitBobby »

semi-extrinsic wrote: post #88
DangitBobby wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because I'm not talking about vacation, I'm talking about the ability to travel and see family or go somewhere new at any point during the year without needing to take time off to do so. My work is programming, and travel has never been a part of the work equation for me. If workspace arrangements weren't an issue, I could go visit my friends from college this very weekend.

Meh, this is mainly a bad excuse. Even when I'm doing CAD or manipulating large 3D datasets, I can get my work done with just a 14" laptop and a good trackball. There is some reduction in efficiency, but mainly due to scp'ing large files or waiting for the slower CPU. For coding it's not an issue at all, as long as you have your toolchain set up properly. I find that the high DPI trend has a tendency to limit us unne…

:thumbs_up: good for you. Doesn't work for me.

Re: The saga of Apple’s troubled mixed reality headset

#105

Post by treesknees »

null_shift wrote: post #91
qgin wrote: post #77

Have to say I agree with Jony Ive on all of these points. The idea of an AR wearable that is tethered to a fixed base station is so very lame. Why even bother with AR when you can only augment the reality that is in your office or bedroom? Also the eye-view outer display is essential for situations where one person is using the goggles but others aren’t. How unsettling would it be for someone to look at you, be able…

The fixed base station is a fundamentally different tradeoff for AR vs VR. Base station for AR would be detrimental, as you inherently want to explore and interact with the world around you. For most VR use cases that is not the case, and I can see the argument for the benefits of a base station (higher performance) outweighing the costs (limited movement).

One solution to this for AR is using "fog computing", where your AR device may offload its computation to a node on the local network that's more powerful but also not as far away (in terms of latency) as a cloud server. Perhaps with the continued adoption of UWB 5G, those AR basestations could exist at cell towers or in local establishments - think about a clothing store running fog nodes to allow AR users to visualize wearing different clothes as they see them in the store.

I haven't read more than the abstract, but it seems there is some good research going into this. It must be years off however, as we barely have LTE networks in some locations, let-alone UWB 5G to even begin supporting this type of architecture.

https://ieeexplore.ieee.org/document/9103475

Re: The saga of Apple’s troubled mixed reality headset

#106

Post by astrange »

bnolsen wrote: post #57
jitl wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On the other hand, no one has released a VR system with mass market appeal. I have and enjoy a Valve Index, but it’s stayed in the box for more than a year because I can’t figure out a socially viable spot for it in my new house. Maybe Ive’s influence on this product will make a big difference.

The Oculus quest 2 definitely has fit that bill. It has game console level sales. How truly useful and confirtable it is may be questionable, but it certainly supports a market.

Are the users actually using it?

Nerd dads are famous for buying anything that might run an NES emulator, then not using it after it turns out their kids have better things to do than listen to square waves.

Re: The saga of Apple’s troubled mixed reality headset

#107

Post by RexM »

Geee wrote: post #48
orbital-decay wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Productivity is correlated with display size That's a dubious statement. Filling the binocular field of view is fine; it's about 120° horizontally, give or take. But past that it starts to be a problem. Generally, if you look at the screen and any edge is blocked by your nose without turning your head, it's likely too large to work comfortably on. (but still fine for immersive content like games or movies)

You can turn also turn your head and move around in your room, i.e. your whole room could be full of separate displays, or just pieces of code floating in space. It's not just how much you see at a time, but how easily you can switch context.

Haha now I can try and figure out where I put that function I’m looking for as if it were the hex wrench included in IKEA furniture.

Re: The saga of Apple’s troubled mixed reality headset

#108

Post by thih9 »

Geee wrote: post #30

Productivity is correlated with display size, and VR should be the next step in productivity, because it allows your whole space to become a display and an interface. When paired with powerful hardware and innovative software it should be the next step in computing. Therefore, VR should be a replacement for large displays in productive work, not a device that everyone is wearing outside or casually watching videos wi…

> Productivity is correlated with display size

Do you have a source?

Anecdotal, I work without external displays and keep one window in focus, this helps my productivity.

Re: The saga of Apple’s troubled mixed reality headset

#109

Post by thih9 »

mrfusion wrote: post #69
jayd16 wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm bullish on VR but I think the "many floating monitors around a desk" is a bad use case. I mean, you can just alt-tab through windows or desktops as it is. In my mind the real power comes from spatial hand tracking as a new UX paradigm(seeing an interacting with objects in 3d space) and possibly the addition of large displays anywhere a monitor couldn't have feasibly been, (eg, floating in the server room in a cra…

Thought experiment: imagine fixing your car engine by tabbing around a little viewport.

I think I’d be fine with that; I’d find the right reference and start working.

When I work on a laptop I also keep one app or one tab in focus most of the time.

Counter example, imagine fixing your car engine and having 100 tabs open everywhere.

Re: The saga of Apple’s troubled mixed reality headset

#110

Post by yazaddaruvala »

qgin wrote: post #77

Have to say I agree with Jony Ive on all of these points. The idea of an AR wearable that is tethered to a fixed base station is so very lame. Why even bother with AR when you can only augment the reality that is in your office or bedroom? Also the eye-view outer display is essential for situations where one person is using the goggles but others aren’t. How unsettling would it be for someone to look at you, be able…

Is it all that different from interacting with people wearing sunnies or ski goggles?
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