Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

College is really, really worth your money

stevereads.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

21–30 of 31 posts

Re: College is really, really worth your money

#21

Post by eel »

tryitnow wrote: post #2

From the article: " Over the course of his working life, a college-educated white male .... will have earned about $2.3 million. His high-school-educated white-male partner will have earned $1.2 million." Let's say college costs $100,000 (tuition plus opportunity cost of income, etc). Now let's say instead of spending that $100,000 on college we invested the money instead at 6% per year returns. That will give you $1…

Won't it take a very long time for the high school graduate to even reach $100,000 in his investment account, assuming he doesn't win a lottery?

If the high school graduate is contributing some monthly amount to an investment account, then the college-educated graduate could also invest at the same rate, making the difference in gains greater again. On top of that, a college graduate has the potential to invest an greater amount than the high school graduate based on the difference in income.

Re: College is really, really worth your money

#22

Post by brc »

fallous wrote: post #12

How about controlling college grads vs trades. I'd eat my hat if a B.A. in Lit comes anywhere close to a licensed plumber or electrician.

You'll generally find the B.A. in Lit doesn't like 'the market'.

Of course, the simple explanation for that is 'the market doesn't like them', so it's mutual dislike.

This is why you'll generally find the largest agitators for changes away from market based economies towards controlled economies (read : more 'fair') are people with the most worthless qualifications. Show me someone who likes socialism and I'll show you someone who studied a (monetary) value-less qualification at university.

Of course, it's a crying shame that poets get paid a fraction of reality TV stars, but that's just a reflection of what society values more.

And that's why plumbers make so much money, because a flushing toilet is about the most valuable thing in society, especially when yours isn't.

Re: College is really, really worth your money

#23

Post by tedunangst »

tryitnow wrote: post #2

From the article: " Over the course of his working life, a college-educated white male .... will have earned about $2.3 million. His high-school-educated white-male partner will have earned $1.2 million." Let's say college costs $100,000 (tuition plus opportunity cost of income, etc). Now let's say instead of spending that $100,000 on college we invested the money instead at 6% per year returns. That will give you $1…

Why does only the high school graduate get to invest? Can't the college graduate invest some of his excess earnings?

Re: College is really, really worth your money

#24

Post by eel »

fdschoeneman wrote: post #15

The data shows correlation, not causation. I can think of at least two causal explanations that would account better. 1) Children born to wealthy parents are both a) more likely to go to college because their parents can pay for it, and b) to step into high paying jobs because of their social networks than poor kids. Thus while there is correlation between college degrees and earning potential, the root cause is bein…

I'd like to point out two additional potential explanations.

3) Children born to wealthy parents are more likely to go to better primary and secondary schools (possibly private schools, or possibly by living in better neighborhoods.) This generally leads to smarter people as mentioned in #2.

4)Secondly, wealthy (or even middle-class) parents are more likely to have a culture of appreciation for education, as education likely played some part in getting them to where they are, and that culture will tend to rub off on their children.

Re: College is really, really worth your money

#25

Post by skeletonjelly »

tryitnow wrote: post #2

From the article: " Over the course of his working life, a college-educated white male .... will have earned about $2.3 million. His high-school-educated white-male partner will have earned $1.2 million." Let's say college costs $100,000 (tuition plus opportunity cost of income, etc). Now let's say instead of spending that $100,000 on college we invested the money instead at 6% per year returns. That will give you $1…

Tricky one. College is an investment in your future. And it's not a linear gain I suppose. And if we're talking long term, inflation is going to bite that deposit in the ass no?

But yes your point is correct, it's not a simple formula. A bit of risk, a bit of "gambling", a bit of crystal ball.

Re: College is really, really worth your money

#26

Post by rcfox »

tieistoowhite wrote: post #14
rcfox wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding you, but the article uses data to show that society values college-educated people more, and you want it to adjust for this? What?

Adjusting for society's bias towards the label helps isolate the actual effect of college. What I would like to understand is whether college is valuable because society thinks so or is there something that college does that is unique to it. (and if the latter is true, is it worth $50k a year?)

Unfortunately, I don't think either of those can be measured empirically.

Re: College is really, really worth your money

#27

Post by rcfox »

brc wrote: post #16
tryitnow wrote: post #2

From the article: " Over the course of his working life, a college-educated white male .... will have earned about $2.3 million. His high-school-educated white-male partner will have earned $1.2 million." Let's say college costs $100,000 (tuition plus opportunity cost of income, etc). Now let's say instead of spending that $100,000 on college we invested the money instead at 6% per year returns. That will give you $1…

A good point well made. The problem is that we're all told 'go to college'. What we're not told is 'go to college and learn a worthwhile skill'. Personally I think the value of a college degree has dropped enormously while the cost has risen. Thus these types of calculations are going to look even skinnier 20 or 30 years down the track. Again, I'm not agitating to not go to college, but I would counsel any college-en…

> The problem is that we're all told 'go to college'.

> What we're not told is 'go to college and learn a worthwhile skill'.

I almost agree with this. I think that there is some ideal number of humanities students to be cranked out of universities per year, but we're way over that. As a result, the demand can't meet the supply. In fact, the demand might be reduced due to the troubles involved in filtering through the flood of applicants.

The real problem is that universities behave like anything else: they'd rather make a quick buck. They admit way more humanities students than are needed because they can make more money that way. Engineering students cost a lot of money, they're whiny, and they smell bad. (Disclaimer: I was a whiny engineering student.) Why would you want more of them when you could surround yourself with kids who cost less and will pay you tons of money just to get away from their parents?

Re: College is really, really worth your money

#29

Post by jjchiw »

Maybe in IT college is overrated, but when is something about i don't know let say medicine.... If I were sick I'll pay the best doctors I could, I won't be looking for somebody that has a fancy ad or millions of likes or followers or pluses and does not have a degree in medicine....

Maybe in the verge of death I'll look for a shaman...

Overall my point is that college is not overrated for all the careers. The article did not focus only on IT....

And IT is not only about coding

Re: College is really, really worth your money

#30

Post by brc »

rcfox wrote: post #27
brc wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A good point well made. The problem is that we're all told 'go to college'. What we're not told is 'go to college and learn a worthwhile skill'. Personally I think the value of a college degree has dropped enormously while the cost has risen. Thus these types of calculations are going to look even skinnier 20 or 30 years down the track. Again, I'm not agitating to not go to college, but I would counsel any college-en…

> The problem is that we're all told 'go to college'. > What we're not told is 'go to college and learn a worthwhile skill'. I almost agree with this. I think that there is some ideal number of humanities students to be cranked out of universities per year, but we're way over that. As a result, the demand can't meet the supply. In fact, the demand might be reduced due to the troubles involved in filtering through the…

Yes, I kind of agree, but I don't blame the universities. They merely respond to demand for humanities by teaching them what they want. I don't want to live in the type of place where students are effectively denied their choice even if it is a stupid choice looking from a monetary point of view. If kids with rich parents want to learn greek literature on their parents dime, well, good luck to them and I hope they get laid with their ability to wear a toga with panache.

It's up to the students to work out for themselves that they're doing a pointless thing, and that it won't pay off. I suspect this is partly an information problem and partly a societal problem - there's too much emphasis on going to college as a social marker and not enough emphasis of what happens when you finish.

Maybe there's a good website weekend project in there to do an cost/benefit analysis of different types of study which calculates the debt, the 1 year, 5 year and 10 year salary ranges for the graduate, and also compares other non-college trades and vocations for equivalent payoffs.

Post reply on HN