Wikileaks Is Running Out Of Cash • Hacker News Board

Re: Wikileaks Is Running Out Of Cash

#111

Post by nir » Tue, Oct 25, 2011, 1:02 AM UTC

Peaker wrote: post #107

nir wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not an American. I've only been living in the US for the a few years. Of course there's some poor reporting in the US, like anywhere else. I don't know of any European/Asian newspaper that does a better job than the NY Times or WaPo (or for that matter any good regional US paper), for all their faults, and those who are comparable are usually less widely read than the American ones.

Have you seen anything like Fox News anywhere else?

I think TV journalism isn't American media's stronger suite, but you could fairly say that globally Fox News is the rule rather than the exception.

Re: Wikileaks Is Running Out Of Cash

#112

Post by bluedanieru » Tue, Oct 25, 2011, 2:03 AM UTC

robfig wrote: post #37

Can someone explain why diplomatic cables should be free and open?

Because the only secrets a government should be allowed to keep are the ones where a loss of secrecy would render the whole point moot. So, for example, when planning a wartime offensive against an enemy the military and by extension the government must have the privilege of keeping their plans a secret, since to do otherwise would make the plans useless. Once keeping the plans secret no longer serves that purpose they should be made public.

Diplomatic cables do not meet this standard in the general case. They are a log of a government's interactions with another government, and thus need to be public so that the people can confirm it is working in their interest, and not conspiring to implement a global copyright regime at the behest of Big Media, or aiding a foreign government in oppressing its people, or sending detainees to foreign soil with the understanding that they'll be tortured, or trying to overthrow democratically-elected leaders, or any of the other reprehensible things that the American government is doing literally while I type this, right now.

Re: Wikileaks Is Running Out Of Cash

#113

Post by geoka9 » Tue, Oct 25, 2011, 4:33 AM UTC

steve19 wrote: post #72

skrebbel wrote: post #63

I'm impressed by the amount of comments here that point out some (perceived) hypocrisy in the actions of Wikileaks or Assange. This isn't the point. I myself don't really know what to think of Wikileaks. I, however, do know that major banks and financial institutions find it perfectly okay for you to send money to all kinds of horrible organisations (say, the Ku Klux Klan, clubs that campaign for underage sex, Westbo…

I am just explaining the reasoning. Don't hate/downvote me for saying it ... Silencing people's political opinions (even horrible evil people) is considered bad. This is why donations to these evil organizations is tolerated. Wikileaks is being blacklisted not because of their political opinions, but because these organizations, rightly or wrongly, believe Wikileaks is threatening security of the nation, causing deat…

> If you bite the hand that feeds you ...

But those organizations don't feed Wikileaks. It's donations that do. In fact, the banks and cc companies are making money off it.

Had they been ordered to shut out Wikileaks through some judicial process I'd have no beef with it.

And I really doubt they did it out of desire to protect informers et al. I wonder if the banks and Visa were pressured into it.

Re: Wikileaks Is Running Out Of Cash

#114

Post by grandalf » Tue, Oct 25, 2011, 5:19 AM UTC

knowtheory wrote: post #18

cube13 wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would love to see that as well, and it would make me much more comfortable with donating to them if I knew that my money was going directly towards supporting their operations(which I support), instead of Assange(whom I do not).

The real question is how many documents they've taken in. The impression i was left with over the split between Wikileaks and OpenLeaks (and incidentally here's link to open leaks: http://openleaks.org/ ) was that WikiLeaks was left w/o any infrastructure to accept new documents, making it, effectively, useless. I am not going to donate to Julian Assange's defense, as i think he's destroyed Wikileaks' credibility and…

Do you have any info to support your assertion?

Re: Wikileaks Is Running Out Of Cash

#115

Post by skrebbel » Tue, Oct 25, 2011, 5:55 AM UTC

jellicle wrote: post #102

skrebbel wrote: post #63

I'm impressed by the amount of comments here that point out some (perceived) hypocrisy in the actions of Wikileaks or Assange. This isn't the point. I myself don't really know what to think of Wikileaks. I, however, do know that major banks and financial institutions find it perfectly okay for you to send money to all kinds of horrible organisations (say, the Ku Klux Klan, clubs that campaign for underage sex, Westbo…

> how the governments just let it happen. In this case, it's pretty clear the U.S. Government is instrumental in making it happen, not allowing it to happen.

I would guess so too, but if you don't make that claim, even the most hardcore non-conspiracy-theorist can't debunk the argument. This is my whole point, and what makes me so angry/afraid: sticking only to the plain facts, the ones that are out there in the open, that everybody agrees on, you can still show that something is horribly wrong with what our governments are doing, without assuming anything beyond those plain facts. That's pretty unique, I believe.

Re: Wikileaks Is Running Out Of Cash

#116

Post by loup-vaillant » Tue, Oct 25, 2011, 6:47 AM UTC

adbge wrote: post #105

loup-vaillant wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You seem to think the term "privacy" (i) can be applied to large organizations such as governments, and (ii) it bears a significant resemblance with an individual's privacy. I can understand (i) (though I would prefer the word "secrecy"), but you really really need to explain (ii). By the way, even if (ii) is correct, it makes little matter, because of the power balance. As Chomsky often points out, when the powerful…

Did you mean to reply to someone else? You two are mostly in agreement.

Oops. Sorry. My mistake. I didn't read correctly, and put a negation where there wasn't.

Re: Wikileaks Is Running Out Of Cash

#117

Post by Tichy » Tue, Oct 25, 2011, 7:26 AM UTC

endtime wrote: post #88

skrebbel wrote: post #63

I'm impressed by the amount of comments here that point out some (perceived) hypocrisy in the actions of Wikileaks or Assange. This isn't the point. I myself don't really know what to think of Wikileaks. I, however, do know that major banks and financial institutions find it perfectly okay for you to send money to all kinds of horrible organisations (say, the Ku Klux Klan, clubs that campaign for underage sex, Westbo…

>I can't imagine how Wikileaks can be considered a so much more evil organisation than Stormfront I can, in spirit, though I wouldn't necessarily use the term "evil" as the comparator. Stormfront generates bigotry and hate speech. Distasteful and contempible. But Wikileaks spreads as widely as possible information which can pose real security risks to people (such as US soldiers). As a Jew, I'd rather see people supp…

How does Wikileaks threaten soldiers? It's not as if they have a live feed from the battlefield, or their own satellite. Also, they seem to scan stuff before they release it. This "threat" really seems to be blown out of proportion.

And what if a Jewish soldier is captured in battle and his enemies are avid readers of Stormfront?

Re: Wikileaks Is Running Out Of Cash

#118

Post by Tichy » Tue, Oct 25, 2011, 7:27 AM UTC

redthrowaway wrote: post #39

Ixiaus wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here's their bitcoin address: 1HB5XMLmzFVj8ALj6mfBsbifRoD4miY36v

The problem with sending money via bitcoin at the moment is that it will likely be worth significantly less tomorrow than it is today, and less still the day after. It would be nice to have a bitcoin alternative that was actually a viable currency; as of now I know of no such thing.

They just have to exchange them back into dollars today then. Why wait till tomorrow?

Re: Wikileaks Is Running Out Of Cash

#119

Post by Tichy » Tue, Oct 25, 2011, 7:29 AM UTC

Ixiaus wrote: post #31

pconf wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also impresses me by how many posts here believe the media coverage of Assange. Just goes to show, Americans are the most naive consumers of commercial news on the planet, by a considerable margin. All I want to know is where I can send a check. Long live government transparency.

Here's their bitcoin address: 1HB5XMLmzFVj8ALj6mfBsbifRoD4miY36v

Do you have a citation for that? I've never visited the Wikileaks site, and now it seems to be down. Edit: oops, never mind, it is at wikileaks.org, not .com - found the BitCoin reference.

Could not make sense of their IRC thing, though. Why not generate a new BitCoin address directly on the page?

Re: Wikileaks Is Running Out Of Cash

#120

Post by gldalmaso » Tue, Oct 25, 2011, 10:20 AM UTC

Peaker wrote: post #107

nir wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not an American. I've only been living in the US for the a few years. Of course there's some poor reporting in the US, like anywhere else. I don't know of any European/Asian newspaper that does a better job than the NY Times or WaPo (or for that matter any good regional US paper), for all their faults, and those who are comparable are usually less widely read than the American ones.

Have you seen anything like Fox News anywhere else?

Brazilian mainstream media is also very partisan-biased, though they won't ever admit it and always strive to come out as politically neutral.

While there's a left-centrist party in office, not one positive news is to be shown in mass media vehicles, even when the president receives an international award, the people are kept in the dark about it and you have to follow alternative news to be informed. This discrepancy has even been reported in international news before.