No, there's dozens of such tokens already but they're not going to replace Bitcoin. The "high" energy consumption is what keeps the network secure in PoW btw, it doesn't work any other way. You're going to see more "green" mining in the future and frankly the cheapest energy will always be overcapacity from renewable sources so that's where mining is going to gravitate towards even without the social pressure. Take farms in Iceland as an example.
Ask HN: Could Bitcoin be replaced by an ERC-20 token?
31–40 of 53 posts
Re: Ask HN: Could Bitcoin be replaced by an ERC-20 token?
#32Of course. Bitcoin has first mover advantage, but its tech has remained fairly stagnant. First mover advantage goes a long way... until it doesn't.
Re: Ask HN: Could Bitcoin be replaced by an ERC-20 token?
#33Earlier quoted context omitted.
Bitcoin is not solving anything really. People think that PoW just solved the trust issue but it has not. On one side Bitcoin still depends on miners and big countries like china could have a significant motivation to do a 51% attack in 20 years. People could form a secret org and take over Bitcoin. Bitcoin would require a lot more independent people to mine which people actually don't care for. And on the other hand…
https://www.endthefud.org
Have you read any of it and actually understood it?
I read now 8 articles and all of them are really bad :-/
I really don't have the motivation to go through all of that Garbage...
One dude compares the Bitcoin energy consumption with aluminum while ignoring that aluminum is actually helpful to smelt while Bitcoin is not.
There is so much ignorance in all of them.
'But how much energy should a monetary system consume?
How you answer that likely depends on how you feel about Bitcoin'
Another one plays around with marginal costs and writes pearls like this: "We will never know for sure but, if we look at the sale prices at the time of mining, and assume that they were mined with minimal initial profit, it comes to less than $20 billion. That would mean we put into circulation coins worth $200 billion for a tenth of their price."
Or this one were he just doesn't care to discuss the obvious issue of dividing bitcoins forever: 'But for now, just work on the assumption that the supply of bitcoin is capped at 21 million. In contrast, no one knows the supply of dollars.'
He just accepts that bitcoins are capped. Totally ignoring also how the transition to Bitcoin would make everyone richer who invests in it first. He just doesn't talk about it. And he goes on and on how Bitcoin is fixed while it's not.
Another article doesn't even mention Bitcoin just inflation and deflation in some weird writing style
And this one even points out issues: "The mining process is arguably wasteful, and justifiably has environmentally conscious people concerned. " Or "For this reason I think that even Bitcoin’s coin allocation schedule is flawed"
Again my question to you: did you read and understood those links you shared?
Re: Ask HN: Could Bitcoin be replaced by an ERC-20 token?
#34Bitcoin is here to stay since it is the only real decentralised system. I know that you guys will say now “bitcoin maximalist”, but hey, ETH is becoming a centralised shitcoin. Just get over it. One last thing: PoS will NEVER be as much as good as PoW. So please document yourself a little bit more regarding energy consumption and what Bitcoin CAN help solving. Nothing is black or white.
Bitcoin is not solving anything really. People think that PoW just solved the trust issue but it has not. On one side Bitcoin still depends on miners and big countries like china could have a significant motivation to do a 51% attack in 20 years. People could form a secret org and take over Bitcoin. Bitcoin would require a lot more independent people to mine which people actually don't care for. And on the other hand…
PoS is just the foundation of a new oligarch system just like the current FIAT system, giving more to who already owns.. lot.
This is what you’re advertising. And I like to think that you’re doing it in good faith.
And btw what you’re saying regarding mining is factually wrong https://endthefud.org/
Re: Ask HN: Could Bitcoin be replaced by an ERC-20 token?
#35Earlier quoted context omitted.
Bitcoin is not solving anything really. People think that PoW just solved the trust issue but it has not. On one side Bitcoin still depends on miners and big countries like china could have a significant motivation to do a 51% attack in 20 years. People could form a secret org and take over Bitcoin. Bitcoin would require a lot more independent people to mine which people actually don't care for. And on the other hand…
PoS is just the foundation of a new oligarch system just like the current FIAT system, giving more to who already owns.. lot. This is what you’re advertising. And I like to think that you’re doing it in good faith. And btw what you’re saying regarding mining is factually wrong https://endthefud.org/
Another person already shared that link collection and it's just utterly garbage. Pls see my other answer regarding that page.
Btw. I actually read now even more articles from that page than before and they all ignore fundamental issues.
To you: did you actually read them?
And no I'm not advocating for a new PoS system. I advocate for our current existing PoS system. That system we currently have. The system which works across our planet, has been grown naturally, is still evolving and actually fixes a ton of issues which have not even be mentioned by Bitcoin bros.
Alone the fact that I can go to a bank with my passport and get money is not solved.
Not one person describes how Bitcoin makes everyone who invests in Bitcoin early rich and everyone else poorer is not mentioned.
Problems like 51% attacks get ignored.
Antidemocratic issues are ignored like sanctions (Russian oligars anyone?)
And I'm not advertising something. I'm only talking against Bitcoin because it's bullshit and it doesn't solve problems. We need to put every non sustainable resource we extract from our earth into renewable energy and not create an additional system which competes with this...
Re: Ask HN: Could Bitcoin be replaced by an ERC-20 token?
#36It's taken more than 10 years for Bitcoin to be as distributed as it is now in regards to mining and halving using POW. But in regards to your question, someone has already made a POS Bitcoin coin called Bitcoin Green in 2017. Whitepaper is link is available here https://www.coingecko.com/en/coins/bitcoin-green "Bitcoin Green (BITG) is a sustainable cryptocurrency modeled after Satoshi Nakamoto’s vision for Bitcoin.…
Bitcoin Green deserved to die because it's yet another blatant cash-grab, as apparent from this nonsense:
> Development Fund: 4%; Awareness Fund: 5%; Community Fund: 4%; Team Fund: 7%
Re: Ask HN: Could Bitcoin be replaced by an ERC-20 token?
#37No, there's dozens of such tokens already but they're not going to replace Bitcoin. The "high" energy consumption is what keeps the network secure in PoW btw, it doesn't work any other way. You're going to see more "green" mining in the future and frankly the cheapest energy will always be overcapacity from renewable sources so that's where mining is going to gravitate towards even without the social pressure. Take f…
How do they handle the additional e-waste?
Re: Ask HN: Could Bitcoin be replaced by an ERC-20 token?
#38Yes it can, but bitcoin is more than a crypto asset. It's turned into a cult that believes certain tenets. That's why I believe that it will never disappear even if the price falls to a fraction of a cent. A radical change like a change to a Ethereum token would never be accepted.
Re: Ask HN: Could Bitcoin be replaced by an ERC-20 token?
#39Earlier quoted context omitted.
> You simply borrow against your existing holdings and pay that debt back while earning interest on your holdings. This model makes that 1-5% cashback on credit cards look like a joke. You can do this today with existing investment portfolios. If someone is willing to give you an unsecured line of credit -without the risk of margin call- why would you borrow against holdings? The magic issue is that markets don’t alw…
Yes, there are risks involved. Not saying there aren't. That said, there can be organizations, which are not credit card companies, that buffer that risk. Correct, this model does not work for everyone's financial situation. However, people who are living paycheck to paycheck arguably shouldn't also be floating on debt. This is why credit cards ask for income statements in order to determine how much credit to extend…
I think people have an overly negative view of debt. People without a money buffer benefit from easy revolving credit. The best and only sane use of credit cards is as a float between paychecks. If you need a real loan for long term debt, I agree that people should get one on much better terms than credit card interest rates.
Paid on fridays but want to grocery shop on Wednesday? Better hope you have enough in your account on Wednesday.
Re: Ask HN: Could Bitcoin be replaced by an ERC-20 token?
#40No, there's dozens of such tokens already but they're not going to replace Bitcoin. The "high" energy consumption is what keeps the network secure in PoW btw, it doesn't work any other way. You're going to see more "green" mining in the future and frankly the cheapest energy will always be overcapacity from renewable sources so that's where mining is going to gravitate towards even without the social pressure. Take f…
How do they handle the additional e-waste?
Additional in relation to what? Legacy systems need hardware and electricity too, people tend to forget this. I'd like to see the math on how much additional hardware is needed, if at all. My suspicion is that there's a lot of redundancy in the current infrastructure because each bank has to maintain their own record, given that they can't trust each other. A trustless and decentralized system, if it became the base layer for interbank payments, might actually reduce resource consumption.