Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Mental illness, mass shootings, and the politics of American firearms (2015)

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

331–340 of 1001 posts

Re: Mental illness, mass shootings, and the politics of American firearms (2015)

#331

Post by BLKNSLVR »

pdonis wrote: post #289
BLKNSLVR wrote: post #233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a psychological link between "freedom" and "guns" going back to US independence. Guns = independence from the yoke of UK rule, therefore guns = freedom from tyranny, therefore guns = good. It's ingrained. A threat to gun ownership is equated to a threat to the freedoms fundamental to what makes the US 'the best country in the world'. Any argument restricting gun ownership, no matter how logical or however gre…

> The US' foundation is based on a war fought for freedom, using guns. A "war fought for freedom" is a long, long way from shooting innocent people at a school. Equating the two is a huge slap in the face to the vast majority of gun owners in the US who are responsible, law-abiding citizens and, while they would use their guns to defend themselves against tyranny, would never even think of using their guns to shoot a…

That's not the point I was trying to make. There's no link between the US' foundation and the shooting school children bar the (intended point) difficulty of restricting gun ownership and access due to the psychological link between gun ownership and country-defining freedom.

Re: Mental illness, mass shootings, and the politics of American firearms (2015)

#332

Post by calvinmorrison »

elementalest wrote: post #319
beloch wrote: post #83

Canada is the U.S.'s neighbour and is probably closer, culturally, than any other nation. Gun ownership is also high in Canada. In terms of guns per capita, the U.S. is #1 by a long shot, but Canada is #7 [1]. In Canada, guns owned per capita is one third of what it is in the U.S.. Canada also has mass shootings. The annual deaths from mass shootings per capita in Canada is 0.032, which is about one third that of the…

Interesting. When compared to places like Australia, where guns are highly regulated and barely anyone owns a gun, such that there have been no mass shootings for 35 years, the solution really is obvious.

> the solution really is obvious.

Well, from a programmers perspective - it's all about what you are optimizing for.

We can end all car related deaths as well by outlawing all automotive vehicles.

We can eliminate or curb most sexual diseases by regimenting who one can have sex with.

We can end homelessness, by quartering local vagrants in the homes of the citizenry.

Solutions are easy. Side effects are less so.

If we are optimizing against the #1 all time cause of non natural death in the world - Democide - an armed populace does wonders.

Re: Mental illness, mass shootings, and the politics of American firearms (2015)

#333

Post by scollet »

settrans wrote: post #108
johnmarcus wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They’re (school shootings) not even a blip on the radar screen in the overall “gun deaths” problem. LOL. Um, IDK, some people might disagree. Some people - like those innocent childrens' parents - might think it's like 99% of the problem.

Surely then, we ought to ban pools, wall off access to the beaches and lakes, and generally prohibit human contact with water, as drowning is 100x more likely to kill than school shootings. And any parents of innocent children who have drowned are no doubt incensed by the outcome!

What the fuck?

Re: Mental illness, mass shootings, and the politics of American firearms (2015)

#334

Post by [deleted] »

jorblumesea wrote: post #263
beloch wrote: post #83

Canada is the U.S.'s neighbour and is probably closer, culturally, than any other nation. Gun ownership is also high in Canada. In terms of guns per capita, the U.S. is #1 by a long shot, but Canada is #7 [1]. In Canada, guns owned per capita is one third of what it is in the U.S.. Canada also has mass shootings. The annual deaths from mass shootings per capita in Canada is 0.032, which is about one third that of the…

I think it's pretty well established that high rates of gun ownership and proliferation of firearms produce mass shootings. Anyone who tries to argue otherwise has their head stuck in the sand.

[deleted]

Re: Mental illness, mass shootings, and the politics of American firearms (2015)

#335

Post by zarzavat »

settrans wrote: post #318
jorblumesea wrote: post #263

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's pretty well established that high rates of gun ownership and proliferation of firearms produce mass shootings. Anyone who tries to argue otherwise has their head stuck in the sand.

This isn't obviously the case (if you consider gun homicide, which is arguably more important since strictly more people are killed than just in mass shootings): https://hwfo.substack.com/p/everybodys-lying-about-the-link-... > Gun Murder Rate is not correlated with firearm ownership rate in the United States, on a state by state basis. Firearm Homicide Rate is not correlated with guns per capita globally. It’s not c…

Naively, you’d expect an inverse correlation between gun ownership and gun murder rate, as (I assume) gun murders are more common in cities where gun ownership is lower (more regulations, faster police response and fewer legitimate use cases).

Re: Mental illness, mass shootings, and the politics of American firearms (2015)

#336

Post by School-Cotton »

iamgopal wrote: post #269

Guns should be removed in its totality. After that if anybody wants they should allow to hold data based intellectual discussion about meaning of the constitution etc. If while we discuss all constitutional rights that were designed almost half millennia ago, people are getting killed, than drastic measures even if temporarily, are necessary.

It’d be great if guns didn’t exist, but since this would require totally abolishing the current political, legal, and cultural system of the US and replacing it with something new, it’s hard to see how to get there in practice.

Re: Mental illness, mass shootings, and the politics of American firearms (2015)

#337

Post by School-Cotton »

paulcole wrote: post #184
elforce002 wrote: post #135

As a foreigner I find this subject very complex since the right to bear arms in on the US constitution. To change or "rewrite" the constitution trying to deal with this subject could dissolve the US. Banning guns altogether (rather improbable) will only leave law abiding citizens at the mercy of criminals. More protection in schools could be a starting point to address these awful events. I'm still in favor of law ab…

> To change or "rewrite" the constitution trying to deal with this subject could dissolve the US. As an American, this is a risk I’m willing to take.

Okay. In practice, how do you plan on achieving this? What steps can we take to “rewrite the constitution” (other than an actual revolution overthrowing the current political system, which… would require guns and even then would probably be impossible)

Re: Mental illness, mass shootings, and the politics of American firearms (2015)

#338

Post by slagfart »

calvinmorrison wrote: post #332
elementalest wrote: post #319

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting. When compared to places like Australia, where guns are highly regulated and barely anyone owns a gun, such that there have been no mass shootings for 35 years, the solution really is obvious.

> the solution really is obvious. Well, from a programmers perspective - it's all about what you are optimizing for. We can end all car related deaths as well by outlawing all automotive vehicles. We can eliminate or curb most sexual diseases by regimenting who one can have sex with. We can end homelessness, by quartering local vagrants in the homes of the citizenry. Solutions are easy. Side effects are less so. If w…

What would the side effects of lower gun ownership be?

Re: Mental illness, mass shootings, and the politics of American firearms (2015)

#339

Post by afarviral »

calvinmorrison wrote: post #332
elementalest wrote: post #319

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting. When compared to places like Australia, where guns are highly regulated and barely anyone owns a gun, such that there have been no mass shootings for 35 years, the solution really is obvious.

> the solution really is obvious. Well, from a programmers perspective - it's all about what you are optimizing for. We can end all car related deaths as well by outlawing all automotive vehicles. We can eliminate or curb most sexual diseases by regimenting who one can have sex with. We can end homelessness, by quartering local vagrants in the homes of the citizenry. Solutions are easy. Side effects are less so. If w…

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democide

> Democide is the murder of any person or people by their government, including genocide, politicide, and mass murder.

Re: Mental illness, mass shootings, and the politics of American firearms (2015)

#340

Post by chmod600 »

An otherwise informative article, but using the term "military-grade" seems out of place.

The term has little meaning. You could call socks "military-grade" as well, and the only meaning that it really conveys is that it was cheap and barely functional enough to win a contract.

And AR15s are cheap. A lot of plastic and aluminum. You could say that's a problem, if you want. But that line of argument doesn't seem to lead anywhere.

In any case, "military-grade" seems like a talking point and nothing more. If anything, it gives the rifle more protection under the second amendment, which specifically references the militia.

Post reply on HN